Burnt Orange Nation: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:

Sports blogs for fans, by fans.
Around SBN: Steve McNair Found Shot to Death
spread the word

Polls & BCS Standings Open Thread

Dark_pumpkin_tiny by awiggo on in Football Comment 415 comments

The USA Today Coaches poll shoud be released about around 11 am, the Harris Poll should be out around 3 pm, and the BCS standings will be released sometime after that.

It is important to note that today is not the end of the race but more like a halfway point. It does matter if Texas is ahead on OU in the BCS this afternoon, but the rankings that matter most come out next Sunday. So, don't get too excited if Texas is No. 2 and OU is No. 3 or 4 this afternoon, as ESPN BCS expert Brad Edwards has predicted. The case for the Longhorns still needs to be made and made loudly.

As BZ has already laid out:

  • Texas was the only team not to play a game at home against the other top two teams in the South.
  • Texas lost on the last play of the game not in a blowout or by double digits on a neutral field.
  • Texas went 3-1 in an unmatched stretch of games, all of which came against top-11 ranked teams.
  • Between Texas and OU, the Longhorns have the more impressive win over Kansas.
  • On average, the Texas non-conference schedule was the toughest of the three, and the Longhorns own the only win over Missouri, the Big XII North champions.
  • And last, 45-35 on October 11th in Dallas.

Use this thread to post your comments as we get the data.

UPDATE: USA Today Coaches Poll Texas #4 and OU #2 with four first place votes. You've got to be f*$^ing kidding.

UPDATE: AP Poll is out and with Texas four points behind OU for third place. Can someone explain why Florida is in front of Texas and OU?

UPDATE: Harris Poll is out. Texas is #4 and OU #3 by a small margin. My projections have Texas holding onto #2 in the BCS, barely

0 recs | Comment 415 comments | Share on Facebook Digg!

Story-email Email Printer Print

More from Burnt Orange Nation

Race for the BCS: A Texas Fan's Rooting Guide

Nov 2008 by PB @ BON - 29 comments

Morning Coffee Is #1 For One More Week

Oct 2008 by PB @ BON - 26 comments

BCS Standings Open Thread

Nov 2007 by PB @ BON - 16 comments

BCS Standings: Week 1 Release

Oct 2007 by awiggo - 24 comments

Around SB Nation

Thursday News and Notes: Coaches Poll Changes in the Air

May 2009 from Garnet And Black Attack - 2 comments

Thursday News and Notes: Carter on His Way Out

May 2009 from Garnet And Black Attack - 6 comments

2009 Big 12 Conference College Baseball Preseason Coaches' Poll

Feb 2009 from Big 12 Hardball - 2 comments

Nitt Picks Is Making Its Own News

Jan 2009 from Black Shoe Diaries - 20 comments

Thank you, Kyle

Jan 2009 from Block U - 10 comments

Read More: bcs standings, coaches poll, harris poll

Comments

Display:

OU's non-conference

is substantially better than ours, mainly due to the wins over Cincy and TCU

by BlinkOneGun on Nov 23, 2008 10:38 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Better only if

you look at Cincy and TCU. When you throw in Chatanooga and Washington, it doesn’t look so hot anymore. Texas didn’t play any potential conference winnner but the Longhorns didn’t play a D-2 team or a winless team either.

Let’s look at all four opponents before calling any schedule “substantially better.”

--AW--

by awiggo on Nov 23, 2008 10:40 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So you believe Texas had

. . a realistic chance to lose to any of those non-conference teams they played, of which Rice (I can’t believe I’m typing this) is pretty clearly the best?

Cincinnati and TCU are top 20 teams in the computers and TCU is actually ahead of Missouri in Sagarin’s ratings. I don’t think they are great teams by any stretch (although TCU might be legitimately top 10 in a perfect world), but I think Oklahoma had a more realistic shot to lose than Texas did in the non-conference schedule.

In other words, if Texas had played say Penn State and 3 D-III schools I would argue that their non-conference schedule was tougher than Oklahoma’s because playing Penn State is a very realistic opportunity to lose regardless of who the other teams are

by DoubleB on Nov 23, 2008 10:54 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't buy this argument

In a college football universe in which a 41.5 point underdog can beat USC, and a 1-AA team (albeit a good one) can beat a Top 5 Michigan, I have to say that there was a chance for Texas to lose those games.

Very minor, as it turned out, but you can’t automatically dismiss a victory over a mediocre SEC team having a down (but not terrible) year.

You also have to look at the aggregate of the games. OU had a bit higher of a chance to lose to Cincy and TCU than we did to Rice or Arkansas. But we had a greater chance of losing any of our games (yes, including FAU) than OU did against UW or Chattanooga.

And all this completely ignores Mizzou.

by kjm017 on Nov 23, 2008 11:04 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

A bit higher??

“OU had a bit higher of a chance to lose to Cincy and TCU.”

That’s a statement I just completely disagree with. They are both top 20 teams. Rice is around 50.

You can also make the legitimate case that TCU is better or as good as Mizzou.

by DoubleB on Nov 23, 2008 11:10 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ignoring, then...

You can claim Chatanooga is horrible, but are the odds of losing to Chatanooga that much worse than the odds of losing to FAU? Is the difference 98% and 99? 99.5 and 99.7%? If we’re talking about Stanford miracles against USC, is Chatanooga that different from UTEP?

Go register. Or else.

by Skin Patrol on Nov 23, 2008 2:23 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That's subjective...

which is the problem here; every facet of this comes down to opinion, except… 45-35.

by crackaTX on Nov 23, 2008 11:05 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

and in a 2-team argument

. . I couldn’t agree with you more. In fact, that would be the tiebreaker. If Tech loses to Baylor (and Texas wins), problem is solved and Texas is the deserving South Division champion.

But right now, it’s not a two-team argument. Tech is still in this discussion whether anyone here likes it or not. Everyone wants to dismiss them for getting blown out last night, but not reward Oklahoma for being the team that put on that beatdown.

There is no good way to determine this should all the teams go 11-1. The only FAIR way would be to draw lots.

by DoubleB on Nov 23, 2008 11:14 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Fair way

I actually think the only fair way to decide would be to leave it completely to the computers.

by Horncasting on Nov 23, 2008 11:18 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Texas Tech is completely out of the national championship picture, and out of the Big 12 conference championship picture except in a scenario in which OU loses to Okie State. So while the three-way tie is relevant in that scenario, it is NOT relevant to the two-team race that OU-UT has become by this point.

by burntorangehorn on Nov 24, 2008 10:13 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So TCU is that good?...

I don’t think they’re bad, but they are getting the benefit of an easy schedule.

TCU @ Co St: 13-7
Co St @ CU: 17-38

West Va Was good enough to play Cincinnati to overtime. Guess what. CU played WVU to overtime also, and beat them. Then we went into CU’s stadium and crushed them.

Our wins over Mizzou and CU are much better than Kstate and Nebraska.

Then look at our mutual opponent: Kansas. Everyone is talking about how well OU played after they lost to us. Does anyone else remember that HOME game for OU against KU? The game that was decided by 14 points and close all the way? The game OU’s spectacular D allowed 35 points? Does anyone else remember that we played AT KU and held them to 7?

by UT_BKC on Nov 23, 2008 11:11 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Also

I think if Ark. and Cincy played it would be a tossup.

by Horncasting on Nov 23, 2008 11:19 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Huh?

Arkansas has 1 win over a BCS conference team this year. They blow

by DoubleB on Nov 23, 2008 11:28 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And Cincy plays in the Big Least

Which will lose it’s BCS affiliation if if keeps having years like this.

by Horncasting on Nov 23, 2008 11:30 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

and Texas beat . .

an OSU team at home by 4 that Tech completely beatdown by 36. Did everyone forget that as well? All that stuff goes both ways.

TCU is 9th in Sagarin’s ratings ahead of Missouri (the system that has UT #1). They had Utah beat on the road if they make 1 FG in the 4th quarter (missed two, one hitting the post). TCU is a very good football team.

by DoubleB on Nov 23, 2008 11:23 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

TCU would be a perennial bottom feeder in the Big 12

Rankins somewhere between Baylor, A&M, Tech and OSU in most years.

by Horncasting on Nov 23, 2008 11:25 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

As much as I don't want to bolster TCU at this point

this isn’t true. We’ve seen in the last few years TCU can hang with anybody. They would annually compete with Tech and OSU, and this doesn’t include the fact that their recruiting would greatly improve if they were playing in a BCS conference.

If you're so sure of what it ain't, how about telling us what it am!

by circa1015 on Nov 23, 2008 11:31 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The same Tech and OSU teams

that routinely drop a game every year to the likes of SMU?

by Horncasting on Nov 23, 2008 11:33 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Good reply

It’s OK to support Texas vociferously and still understand that this entire thing right now is a complete shitstorm.

by DoubleB on Nov 23, 2008 11:34 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

DoubleB is exactly right..

It is a shitstorm. The Big 10 breaks tiebreakers by eliminating teams that have played the most D-1aa teams. Tech has played 2, OU has played 1, Texas played 0. Would you prefer that method? To encourage tougher non-con scheduling and to keep the decision in house and not upto whoever the hell the Harris voters are?

by the1austin on Nov 23, 2008 11:46 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

SEC 3-way tie breaker

They look at BCS, eliminate the worst ranked team of the 3, and then it goes to head-to-head between the other 2. Which in this case would go to UT.

Not saying this is any more or less fair (I’d prefer just using the computer polls) just pointing it out.

by Horncasting on Nov 23, 2008 11:52 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And when this was used in the SEC in 2003

Georgia finished ahead of Florida in the BCS because the refs stole the FSU game from UF. So UF lost the SEC… to FSU (and the BCS). So trust me I know the situation sucks, but right now I think either decision (Texas or Oklahoma) can be defended. It’s going to come down—like it did in 2006—to which way the most visible analysts (read: talking heads on ESPN) start leaning and advocating.

I think Texas is the easier team to argue for, but if you watched that game last night it sure SEEMED decisive… It’ll be close, and ugly.

by Gator Cub on Nov 23, 2008 12:15 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

SEC rule over ESPN

I’d rather have the SEC rule then the talking heads decide the winner of the BIg12. In the end on-the-field performance is the deciding factor (after we begrudgingly use the BCS to eliminate one of the teams). It’s still not great but better than just passing the decision to a bunch of folks around the country with their own agendas, sponsors and advertisers to keep happy, etc.

by drycreek on Nov 23, 2008 12:20 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Did they change the rule in the SEC after that year?

That year it was a “vote of the SEC ADs not involved with the tie”—and since that was so sketchy, they all voted in early November to make their vote for the team with the best BCS ranking the weekend before the championship game.

by Gator Cub on Nov 24, 2008 7:46 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What about Rice

Re: not playing any potential conference winner, isn’t Rice at least a co-champion if it wins its game against U of H, and conference champion if Tulsa loses its last game?

"Only angry people win football games." --DKR

by OBdoc on Nov 23, 2008 1:52 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It is logically impossible

for a team’s OOC schedule to go from better to worse than another team’s if you add in wins for the team currently on top. If OU’s schedule is better at 2-0 against TCU and Cincy than UT’s 4-0 OOC record (maybe that’s true, maybe it isn’t), you can’t make OU’s schedule worse by increasing their wins to 4-0. There are no opponents bad enough to make 2-0 worse than 4-0.

Go register. Or else.

by Skin Patrol on Nov 23, 2008 2:20 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No it isn't

OU’s schedule under your system may not get worse going from 2-0 to 4-0, but UT’s can definitely get better going from 2-0 to 4-0. The additional 2 wins over much better teams than the other two OU played give the SOS advantage to UT, like it or not.

by HookedinOKC on Nov 23, 2008 5:13 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wasn't clear.

If OU’s 2-0 schedule is better than UT’s 4-0 schedule, you can’t make UT’s schedule better than OU’s by adding two wins to OU’s schedule.

As an example, it wouldn’t make sense to say UT’s victory over OU is more impressive than OU’s victory over Tech, but that UT’s victory over OU combined with their victory over Missouri is worse than OU’s victory over Tech. That seems to be the methodology if you are saying that, because OU’s non-con schedule is against 4 opponents who are, combined/averaged/etc., worse than UT’s non-con opponents (per Jeff Sagarin) UT has the better schedule. But if someone sensibly believes that beating TCU and Cincy is more impressive than beating FAU and Arkansas and Rice and UTEP, you can’t say that OU is somehow worse for also beating Chatanooga and Washington on top of that. That would be illogical.

I suppose if someone believes that beating FAU, Rice, Arkansas, and UTEP is more impressive than beating TCU and Cincy, it doesn’t really matter who else OU played if they are patsies. I just don’t think UT’s non-con is better than half of OU’s non-con.

Their conference victory over Missouri is a big deal, though.

Go register. Or else.

by Skin Patrol on Nov 23, 2008 6:10 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

subjective vs. objective

Each game you play introduces another chance for a loss, so you have to count all 4 of the teams. Subjectively, you say OU 2 wins against better teams are more impressive, but I say that Texas 2 wins against their worst teams are better than OU’s against their worst. Those 2 games introduce more chance for injuries and a slightly higher chance of a loss. We are both looking at it subjectively, and I think given the 6 computer rankings with their SOS calculations, the more objective view is that Texas was slightly harder/better.

by HookedinOKC on Nov 23, 2008 6:35 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'm still not being clear.

The original point is that IF you think OU beating TCU and Cincy is more impressive than beating FAU, Arkansas, Rice, and UTEP, THEN it necessarily is the case that OU beating TCU and Cincy and Washington and Chatanooga is more impressive than beating FAU, Araknsas, Rice, and UTEP.

You obviously don’t think beating TCU and Cincy is more impressive than beating FAU, Arkansas, Rice, and UTEP. If that’s the case, there isn’t anything logically inconsistent with saying UT’s non-con is better than OU’s non-con.

I’m of the opinion that victories over TCU and Cincy are better than UT’s full 4 game schedule. In virtue of that, it is logically impossible for UT’s schedule to leap frog OU’s by introducing games OU won, ie: Chatanooga and Washington. Beating TCU and Cincy is not, cannot be, less impressive than beating TCU, Cincy, Chatanooga, and Washington.

Go register. Or else.

by Skin Patrol on Nov 23, 2008 6:46 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree with your logical conclusion given your premise, so we really have no argument. I guess we just value the wins against a team ranked ~80 vs a team ranked ~145 differently. One has that much more chance to upset you and that much more chance to get your starters injured since you’ll be playing them longer before getting into garbage time.

by HookedinOKC on Nov 23, 2008 7:06 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

OU didn't play any D2 teams, either

Chattanooga is I-AA

there is a big difference between I-AA and D-II

I Am The 12th Man.com

by Beergut on Nov 23, 2008 5:42 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You're right, semantics, but...

I’d like to see how Chattanooga would do against a good D-II team. They’re 1-11 right now.

by Horn Brain on Nov 24, 2008 12:35 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

BCS

ESPN had prelim BCS projection as follows:
1. Alabama
2.Texas
3. Florida
4. Oklahoma
5. USC

by burntorange81 on Nov 23, 2008 10:40 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Mizzu Game

I think the fact that the Horns have already beat the Big 12 North champ should weigh in heavily. The sad fact is that pollsters have a short term memory and what they saw last night will directly affect the way they vote. No matter who the Horns beat earlier in the season. ESPN is now a BCS proponent and will not say anything that would encourage a playoff…they are going to suck the dong of the BCS for now on. The “Hotter” team is their new term…

by Dawnpatrol on Nov 23, 2008 11:01 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Mizzou not that good,

nor is the Big 12 North this year. The tigers went 1-2 (nearly 0-3) against the south, and the division as a whole went 3-15, with their only wins coming against Baylor and tamu.

by limnonectes on Nov 23, 2008 3:03 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Every week OU wins...

this also bolsters our computers numbers, just as much as Mizzou keeps winning for us. The computers will keep loving us because the top teams we beat keep winning. The reverse can also be said that losses by FAU, Arky and UTEP hurt our computer numbers as well. Top to bottom, Texas’ non-conference schedule is more solid than OU’s. We didn’t play a winless Pac-10 team (Washington), or a Chattanooga (Div II?).

by HornsFaninCalifornia on Nov 23, 2008 11:11 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The best argument that I can make is this...

No one, I repeat, NO ONE can make the case for Tech at this point. You cannot lose by 40 and claim any right to play for a title. To put ou ahead of Texas at this point is to say that Tech’s win over Nebraska, at home, in OT, was more important than 45-35. Without that, this is a two-way, and guess what the first tie-breaker is. 45-35

by ctex80 on Nov 23, 2008 11:19 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I love this argument

So because Oklahoma beat Tech by TOO MUCH, Tech must be eliminated from the discussion entirely and it goes back to the head-to-head argument. If Oklahoma had only won by 14 or so, would Tech still be in the discussion?

by DoubleB on Nov 23, 2008 11:29 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Dude, no way does a team who lost by 44 get into the MNC

Even if OSU beat OU and Tech won the South. A win against Missouri wouldn’t be enough to elevate Tech in the the Top 2. I know that sucks, but that’s the way it is.

by the1austin on Nov 23, 2008 11:34 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wrong argument

ctex80 is arguing that because Tech got blown out, they are no longer in any poll discussion and therefore it reverts back to an OU-UT ONLY discussion which Texas wins by virtue of the head-to-head victory. If Tech had lost by only 14 or so, you couldn’t make that argument.

In essence, ctex80 is arguing because Oklahoma played SO WELL last night, they’ve actually eliminated themselves.

by DoubleB on Nov 23, 2008 11:41 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

OU has nearly played themselves out of the Big 12 Champ depending on this poll

We beat OU and lost to Tech on the last second play. OU then comes back and pummels Tech. If we are in fact in front of OU in the poll, we will keep our spot next week with a win over aTm no matter if OU beats OSU.

by BlinkOneGun on Nov 23, 2008 11:45 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think he's right

I dont think that’s fair to OU, but it very well may happen.

had Oklahoma barely won, it would have been the voters’ job to choose between 3 teams, which makes arguing “we won the head to head” impossible. And that’s texas best argument.

But now the voters are clearly down to choosing between UT and OU. And i think that in deciding between only two teams, the head-to-head result has more sway.

by Gator Cub on Nov 23, 2008 12:21 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Running up the score

So in fact Stoops decision to keep the 1st string in last night and run up the score for style points, could hurt them in the end,

by drycreek on Nov 23, 2008 12:28 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Tech has alot going against it

When look at the 3-game round robin, Tech is the only team that got drilled it it’s loss (and quite frankly everyone that watched the game knows it wasn’t as close as the game indicated. They also have the least impressive win (at home, last second, smallest margin of victory).

They can make no argument for having a tougher schedule either OOC, in conference or in total.

And that is just taking into account the tangible things. They also have (unfairly) history, prestige, fanbase, etc. against them.

by Horncasting on Nov 23, 2008 11:37 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Because the argument that ou has to make is that they should be in based on technicality

that Tech has the same record as ou and Texas. It is clear to everyone (including Tech fans) that Tech no longer belongs in this conversation. ou just happened to be the first good team Tech played on the road.

by ctex80 on Nov 23, 2008 11:55 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Am I the only one that remembers

when Miami lost to Washington back in ’00 (neither made the MNC game), and both finished with one loss (Washington to a very good Oregon team, not even as good as TTU this year mind you) and people went so apeshit over the results that the BCS instituted the “quality win” bonus added after the raw score?

Yeah, people were SCREAMING about head to head then.

AND for those screaming PLAYOFF! Well, let’s assume they want UT, OU, UF, and Bama in their final four: guess what – THE SEASON THEN BECAME THE PLAYOFF. SEC Title + Shootout does that.

In other words, anyone who is a playoff supporter (not me) is REQUIRED to vote Texas over OU.

by amorphous on Nov 23, 2008 11:20 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

+1

Agreed. Anybody who votes OU over Texas has no right to ask for playoff. You can’t have it both ways. Decide if you want a playoff, and if so, act (vote) like it.

by drycreek on Nov 23, 2008 12:30 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

UF lost a game and is now playing great ball. Everyone is saying “it will be decided on the field” if UF beats and undefeated Bama.

Yet when we talk about OU versus UT, no one is interested that the game was decided on the field? If the OU UT game were later in the year, UT would be 10-1, OU would be 11-0, and Texas would be the ‘hot’ team since their loss. It would be the same situation as UF vs Bama. And it has been decided on the field. UT won 45-35.

by UT_BKC on Nov 23, 2008 11:21 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Transitive property is worthless

To all the OU fans saying “we blew out the team that beat you”, we can just as easily say “we beat the team that blew out Tech”. All that matters is what happened on the field. Thanks for exposing Tech as the frauds that they are, but you have to deal with the fact that because of that, the conversation is now only about OU and Texas, which has one very simple answer: 45-35.

If you're so sure of what it ain't, how about telling us what it am!

by circa1015 on Nov 23, 2008 11:29 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Encouraging sign

So far, in every discussion I’ve seen, the TV talking heads have mentioned the head-to-head matchup on a neutral field as the decisive factor. No-one seems to be advocating OU.

I think what may be happening is that no-one really believed in Tech, so the beatdown was expected or even welcomed.

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. If they get mad, you're a mile away AND you have their shoes.

by Caradoc on Nov 23, 2008 11:44 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

kirk and corso

said they are keeping Texas over OU, Corso having us in 2nd and Kirk in 3rd

by BlinkOneGun on Nov 23, 2008 11:46 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think everything comes down to next week's games

We are essentially tied with OU in everyones minds.
On the agenda
1. Beat TAMU 56-0
2. OU have at least some trouble with OKST (we only won 28-24, could have been 35-24)

by 2Bearnest on Nov 23, 2008 11:49 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

AP Poll Out

Ou ahead of Texas !! OU third, Texas fourth. OU ahead by 4 points.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/rankingsindex

by the1austin on Nov 23, 2008 11:53 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Tech Falls to #7. They are done.

1. Alabama (63) 11-0 1,622
 2. Florida (2) 10-1 1,512
 3. Oklahoma 10-1 1,486
 4. Texas 10-1 1,482
 5. USC 9-1 1,352
 6. Penn State 11-1 1,238
 7. Texas Tech 10-1 1,212
 8. Utah 12-0 1,206
 9. Boise State 11-0 1,064
10. Ohio State 10-2 1,043

by the1austin on Nov 23, 2008 11:55 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Chances of OU and UT in MNC????

1. Florida lose to Florida State then beats Alabama
or Alabama lose to Auburn then beats Florida

2. Texas and OU win out convincingly. Doesn’t matter who goes to Big 12 Championship

Would this scenario put OU and Texas in Championship game? or would they throw in a USC team?

by 2Bearnest on Nov 23, 2008 11:54 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Probably

All Big XII. But Penn State and USC would surely be jumping up and down screaming.

--AW--

by awiggo on Nov 23, 2008 11:56 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Nah… Don’t forget I’m 6 hours ahead and an early riser!

Besides, it’s fun to speculate.

Still a Blaine Irby fan

by patienthornsfan on Nov 23, 2008 12:03 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Florida D-Line takes a hit
Lawrence Marsh and Matt Patchan injured their left knees during Saturday’s 70-19 victory over The Citadel. Coach Urban Meyer said Sunday that Patchan would not play against the Seminoles and called Marsh questionable for the game.

Gators Injuries

Still a Blaine Irby fan

by patienthornsfan on Nov 23, 2008 12:18 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

OU 1486 Texas 1482

Virtual tie

Still a Blaine Irby fan

by patienthornsfan on Nov 23, 2008 11:54 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

that's the AP which doesn't count, but is a bad sign

Texas led OU by 68 points in the AP last week. The AP voters have never had OU above us in any post-RRS polls unlike the Coaches poll which only narrowly moved us up last week. If the AP has OU narrowly ahead I would expect the coaches to be somewhat sizeably turned away from us.

by the chairman211 on Nov 23, 2008 12:02 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Virtual tie in AP means nothing

A virtual tie in the coaches and Harris polls mean something for the BCS but the only thing the AP counts for is creating the narrative. Even though it’s a virtual tie, OU has that #3 next to their name all week while Texas has #4.

by billyzane on Nov 23, 2008 11:58 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

But..

this whole time you were saying that the points (votes) and not the numerical ranking is what counts. Why not now?

by HornsFaninCalifornia on Nov 23, 2008 12:06 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

because no one else knows that but BZ and us

Everyone else is a robot that sees #3 OU and #4 Texas, hence “open the floodgates, it’s officially ok to vote OU over Texas.”

But it’s not. Scoreboard, people.

by Horn Brain on Nov 23, 2008 12:07 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

possibly the opposite?

people see OU ahead of us and say wait a minute, UT beat OU – I am voting Texas even higher now to compensate??

by 2Bearnest on Nov 23, 2008 12:09 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Pollsters should have considered this...

OU had to play 8 games before becoming bowl eligible right?
Texas just finished a 9 game stretch, 9 freaking games in a row.
Texas did have the toughest road to the 10-1 three way tie.

And for all the talking head saying that Oklahoma is the hot team right now, I seem to remember them being the hot team several weeks ago when they stepped onto a neutral field against the Longhorns and they lost by 10 points.

by urbanzero on Nov 23, 2008 11:59 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

USA Today Poll late

Most Sundays this poll comes out around 11 am central. An hour later and still nothing. Interesting.

--AW--

by awiggo on Nov 23, 2008 11:59 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Coach's Poll

Is it correct that only the last Coach’s poll is public? Is it possible there could be shenanigans in the second to last poll in regards to the big 12 and then this is “corrected” the next week?

For example, rank Texas at #25, and then change it to third the next week? Nobody would know who was doing it.

by JohnsonUT on Nov 23, 2008 12:01 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Petition the BCS to open their poll next week

The Big 12, ESPN and the rest of the media should petition the BCS to open their poll next week in addition to the last week to avoid any funny business. The voters should not have an issue as they will be required to be open the following week. And it would bring a lot more peace and support for the system.

Open the BCS.

by drycreek on Nov 23, 2008 12:39 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Being overlooked here

is that Florida played the Citadel. We need them as a wedge between us and OU on as many ballots as possible.

by Horn Brain on Nov 23, 2008 12:05 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Sagarin rating

1. Texas
2. Tech
3. Bama
4. ou (sucks)
5. Utah
6. Ok. State
7. Florida

Note that this is the ELO_Chess ranking which is used in the BCS. Since the Colley Matrix will likely still have us at 1, we will have a first place computer ranking that won’t be dropped. Which means that we will get a boost in the computers this week. Since our computer lead over OU and Florida has been pretty sizable lately, we should stay at 2 in the BCS as long as the gap between us and them in the human polls remains small.

by mnHorn on Nov 23, 2008 12:13 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Former Stoops Assistants and Bosses in the Coaches Poll

I mentioned this 2 weeks ago that this could be a player if it came down to a three-way tie. Although seedy, I expect Stoops to lobby loud especially to his former assistants and bosses who have ballots in the Coaches Poll. Leach has already said that he’d vote OU ahead of us. He may even vote us outside the Top 10.

by HornsFaninCalifornia on Nov 23, 2008 12:17 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Off-Topic

Watching the Titans and Jets. Kerry Collins is playing really poorly so far. May see some Vince Young today….

by 2Bearnest on Nov 23, 2008 12:18 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Interesting tidbit on this front
The Tennessee Titans are determined to not only sign quarterback Kerry Collins to a new contract that brings him back in 2009 but they also will make a significant effort to sign Chris Simms who, like Collins, is scheduled to be a free agent after this season, team sources told ESPN’s Chris Mortensen.

If Collins should lead the Titans into the playoffs, the team will attempt to sign him to a contract that conditionally pays him as a starter.

Titans Have 3 QBs

Still a Blaine Irby fan

by patienthornsfan on Nov 23, 2008 12:20 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Stoops/Brown Coaching disciples with Coaches Poll Votes

Frank Beamer, Virginia Tech; Mike Bellotti, Oregon; Bret Bielema, Wisconsin; Bobby Bowden, Florida State; Tommy Bowden, Clemson; Art Briles, Baylor; Mack Brown, Texas; Neil Callaway, Alabama-Birmingham; Gene Chizik, Iowa State; Mario Cristobal, Florida International; Sylvester Croom, Mississippi State; Mark Dantonio, Michigan State; Butch Davis, North Carolina; Todd Dodge, North Texas; Randy Edsall, Connecticut; Phillip Fulmer, Tennessee; Jeff Genyk, Eastern Michigan; Turner Gill, Buffalo; Joe Glenn, Wyoming; Todd Graham, Tulsa; Jim Grobe, Wake Forest; Dan Hawkins, Colorado; Pat Hill, Fresno State; Butch Jones, Central Michigan; Steve Kragthorpe, Louisville; Mike Leach, Texas Tech; Jim Leavitt, South Florida; Rocky Long, New Mexico; Bill Lynch, Indiana; Doug Martin, Kent State; Urban Meyer, Florida; Les Miles, LSU; Shane Montgomery, Miami (Ohio); Hal Mumme, New Mexico State; Rick Neuheisel, UCLA; Tom O’Brien, North Carolina State; George O’Leary, Central Florida; Gary Patterson, TCU; Bo Pelini, Nebraska; Chris Petersen, Boise State; Gary Pinkel, Missouri; Mike Price, Texas-El Paso; Mark Richt, Georgia; Mike Riley, Oregon State; Rich Rodriguez, Michigan; Greg Schiano, Rutgers; Howard Schnellenberger, Florida Atlantic; Mark Snyder, Marshall; Frank Solich, Ohio; Steve Spurrier, South Carolina; Rick Stockstill, Middle Tennessee; Jeff Tedford, California; Joe Tiller, Purdue; Bob Toledo, Tulane; Dick Tomey, San Jose State; Jim Tressel, Ohio State; Tommy Tuberville, Auburn; Charlie Weis, Notre Dame; Kyle Whittingham, Utah; Tyrone Willingham, Washington; Ron Zook, Illinois.

Mack has Chizik with a vote. Stoops has Leach. Am I missing anyone?

by the1austin on Nov 23, 2008 12:32 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

shood you consider...

Bowden (Mack worked for him)
Dodge (Mack recruited his son)
Price (UTEP played us)
Schnellenberger (played us)
Dick Tomey (worked for Mack)

by BMG on Nov 23, 2008 12:35 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Missouri

I wonder who Gary Pinkel would prefer?

The pride and winning tradition of The University of Texas will not be entrusted to the weak or the timid.

Hook'em

by longhorns1 on Nov 23, 2008 4:43 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

USA Today Poll

2. ou 1412
4. Texas 1370

by mnHorn on Nov 23, 2008 12:36 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

that's just ludicrous

the only real justification is “what have you done for me lately,” which ends up being determined by schedule chronology. if UT and OU both played tech, with the same results, in september, and texas beat oklahoma in Dallas in November, we’d be #2 and they’d be #4.

by APinAustin on Nov 23, 2008 12:44 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Go Okie State

Much more probable in Stillwater

by shadyrock on Nov 23, 2008 12:42 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

yes but...

Then we’re left with a tie against tech. They win with that. I’d rather just wish see Baylor channel number 10 and rip Tech to pieces. It would be quite comical to see the Tacklin’ Baptists beat 2/3 big 12 Texas teams this year and still be 5-7

by kriess on Nov 23, 2008 12:46 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Thing is...

Tech is so far down that they’re not gonna catch us even if they win the Big XII title. Go Cowboys and Bears!

"Either we need to re-calibrate our rectangle, or Alfonzo Marquez is not having a good night." - Josh Lewin

by utlonghorn24 on Nov 23, 2008 1:08 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wow, I'm shocked

I thought it would be close and it is but in my scariest of nightmares I didn’t think OU could jump Texas and Florida to No. 2 and grab first place votes. Funny business for sure. This is total bullshit.

--AW--

by awiggo on Nov 23, 2008 12:44 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

take a step back from the ledge...

OU got 4 first place votes, but they are actually an extremely weak #2 in the poll.

1464 would be the expected value for a #2 ranking and OU got 1412.
Texas actually has a pretty strong #3 1370 vs the expected 1342.

Yes, its a screw job right now, but this is just the first of 3 pieces. It looks to me like there is no real consensus at the moment, which hopefully means we can sway things on thursday.

by BMG on Nov 23, 2008 12:50 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No jumping yet

But if OU goes to Stillwater and beats OSU they will be looked at as an even stronger team in both the polls and by the computers. Texas really needed to hold off OU this weekend, start working the media, and hope they held them off. To give up this much ground in the Coaches poll is very disappointing.

If the Harris poll looks similar, we will be rooting for Ok State on Saturday.

--AW--

by awiggo on Nov 23, 2008 12:52 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Exactly

In terms of percentage of the possible vote (which the BCS uses) here are the numbers:

1. Bama .9638
2. ou .8965
3. Florida .8895
4. Texas .8698

Texas actually gained points. OU’s margin over Texas is a bit higher than Texas’s over OU last week, but, like I said before, the computers should do a good job of equalizing things as long as the Harris voters don’t screw us.

by mnHorn on Nov 23, 2008 1:19 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

OU will go down or I will.......

OSU is going to beat OU next Saturday. Texas is going to crush A&M thursday. If Texas gets beat by A&M, i will move from Jackson Hole to College Station and work as a custodian at Kyle field for an entire season.

by Dawnpatrol on Nov 23, 2008 12:47 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Can someone explain...

…what is this big fascination with Florida?

What have they done but get beat by Ole Miss at home and win against overrated Georgia and a not-so-very-good LSU squad.

by HornPride on Nov 23, 2008 12:49 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

they

Media has latched on to Tebow…

by Dawnpatrol on Nov 23, 2008 12:50 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Florida doesn't matter. What does matter is that everyone knows

That UT, OU, Florida, and Alabama are the four best teams in the country. We, for the first time in BCS history, are lucky enough to have four teams left that have all played one of the other teams. I can’t believe the argument isn’t about head to head wins.

Also, Florida and Alabama will play on a neutral field. Just like OU and Texas did. It is a perfect playoff.

by the1austin on Nov 23, 2008 12:55 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Go read Doc Saturday

You CANNOT ignore the other 11 games. There’s more data out there. I lean toward Texas, but there’s a legitimate argument to make for Oklahoma. Neither (or either, depending on how you look at it) of the possible results is a screwjob.

by Gator Cub on Nov 23, 2008 1:29 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Exactly...

…Since it’s a 3 way tie, you can’t go strictly by head to head. You have to compare Texas’, OU’s, and Tech’s ENTIRE bodies of work into consideration. Tech won’t get much of a look because they just got destroyed, plus their body of work is probably the weakest of the 3 anyway. OU has a very good case already, and that case will get better with a win in Stillwater next week. I know it’s tempting to just point to October 11th, but you just can’t use that as the sole basis for Texas’ argument because you’ll just end up going in circles.

by Sweed4Heisman on Nov 23, 2008 1:34 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

SEC

And they’re “vaunted” defense. Unfortunately, whoever represents the Big XII needs to light up Florida/Alabama to shut up the pundits. Between Florida and Alabama, Florida seems to be playing better and definitely has the better offense. Plus Florida has more props given their more recent NC and Tebow. I’m sure the odds makers will have them favored over Texas or OU.

The pride and winning tradition of The University of Texas will not be entrusted to the weak or the timid.

Hook'em

by longhorns1 on Nov 23, 2008 4:54 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If this is how the Harris shakes out...

… go Baptists, go FSU. If Baylor wins, we will jump back over OU in all the polls, either immediately or when we beat Mizzou. If FSU beats Florida, that will at least bring us closer to OU in the coaches, which will help us catch up.

by Horn Brain on Nov 23, 2008 12:57 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

SEC

Florida and Bama still have to play each other, and they each have games next week that they could lose, IMHO. Stranger things have happened.

There are so many scenarios that could help or hurt Texas, I think I’m just going to sit out on the BCS debates. If it comes down to politics and ESPN shows deciding who goes to the NC game, then so be it, but I’m not going to go all crazy about it if Texas gets the shaft… they should have beaten Tech.

by SelimSivad on Nov 23, 2008 12:58 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Some kewl and complex jazz would be great.

Better than the convoluted cacophony we’re hearing now.

by whills on Nov 23, 2008 1:15 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Missouri

just noticed that Missouri is ranked higher than Ok State in the usatoday poll… interesting

by SelimSivad on Nov 23, 2008 1:01 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

There are so many reasons to vote Texas over OU

Another one: Texas beat the best team on their schedule, OU lost to theirs. Texas showed up when it mattered most, OU choked and was outclassed.

by Horn Brain on Nov 23, 2008 1:02 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Worse

So, by your logic, wouldn’t you agree that OU’s loss to their ‘best’ opponent is a BETTER loss than Texas’ loss to a lesser opponent than their best???

That’s one of the main criteria why UT got jumped. Period.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:22 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Depends on whether you want another Sooner Smackdown in the NCG

Or another instant classic Longhorns victory as we scrape and claw our way through the game and refuse to go down. Don’t forget, too, that they call holding outside the Big 12. Good luck with that offense of yours.

by Horn Brain on Nov 23, 2008 1:25 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No difference in O line play

Don’t throw stones in your glass house. McCoy gets as many non-calls as any other Big12 team…

The difference that’s happened since the Cotton Bowl is a running game and a balanced attack.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:27 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And you can say Tech choked big time last night.

They didn’t take the points, the FG when it was 14-0, and kept trying to make the big play instead of making the consistently good play. They gambled when they should have taken the points or played field position. Leach blew it big time, giving in to his delusions of grandeur.

Quite frankly, we can’t abuse him enough, even those he had the world to gain and lost in a most pitiful manner.

However, the Horns haven’t choked. Even when down, they made good decisions and fought back. They didn’t get the play they needed, but they were in position to make it and win it all. That’s the best you can do with a young team.

This is a long campaign, so don’t get discouraged. Let the transparent injustice seep to the surface.

by whills on Nov 23, 2008 1:23 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Voters...

I knew we couldn’t trust the voters, they only look at week by week, as if the rest of the season never happened. Plus, now OU (who sucks) will get to go to another BCS game and choke again.

by future_longhorn_dad on Nov 23, 2008 1:06 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

BCS projections

This guy updates the BCS standings as they come in. Right now he is just estimating the Harris Poll and most of the computers.

http://www.tellshowbcs.com/index.html

He still thinks Texas will remain at #2 this week.

http://www.tellshowbcs.com/bcsc.html

by JohnsonUT on Nov 23, 2008 1:18 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If OU makes it to the National title game

We should root for them. Hear me out:

Texas will almost surely be the #3 team if OU makes it to Miami. If OU wins over Florida, the Gators will have two losses, and therefore will drop behind us in the AP. If Texas beats their opponent (hopefully USC) convincingly, It will be Texas and OU at the top, with the same record (OU will have one more win from the CCG, but they played Chattanooga) and Texas will have beaten OU. That means we win the AP national title, and OU wins the BCS. We settle it in Dallas next year, after OU graduates their whole offensive line. I hate OU. Hate them.

by Horn Brain on Nov 23, 2008 1:20 PM CST reply reply actions actions   1 recs

If the voters already disregard the head-to-head...

Why would they not do the same at the end of the year? If you ask me, a vote for OU over Texas is a vote for everything that is wrong with college football. It is a vote against deciding the championship on the field. I don’t see how anyone can vote for OU over Texas and still advocate a playoff.

by racecarr on Nov 23, 2008 1:22 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

or we send stoops an invitation to take us on again in the cotton bowl

two weeks later, the weekend between the nfl conference championship games and the super bowl.

oh, and we invite the newly inaugurated president too.

by APinAustin on Nov 23, 2008 1:23 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Now you are just grasping at straws.

No you guys won’t win a national title like that. There will be no USC vs. LSU scenario. Florida would be a deserving number two/number one unlike OU in 2003. It won’t happen.

by PrimeTime2012 on Nov 23, 2008 2:30 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If OU wins, Florida wouldn't be #1

Florida would have two losses, Texas would have one, Texas beat OU, the AP will put Texas ahead of OU. They would love that.

by Horn Brain on Nov 23, 2008 2:34 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Lots of Football Left

There’s still lots of football left. No reason to worry too much until there is reason to.

**Bedlam always lives up to its name. OU has lost to OSU with MNC hopes on the line before – it just so happens that this is a really solid OSU team.

**Let’s not forget that Florida and Bama play each other in the SEC Championship. Everyone has given Florida the benefit of the doubt for beating overrated LSU and UGA teams. Let’s see how that game plays out before we give them the nod.

**Finally – even assuming OU beats OSU, they have to get past Mizzou. Mizzou has got to have a chip on their shoulder from last year. They have a much better defense than Tech and (IMHO) a better coached team.

I’m not saying we shouldn’t be disappointed in today’s results, but, I for one would rather be in this position than having lost to OU and beat Tech later in the season. No matter how it turns out…Let’s beat ATM and have beaten both of our TRUE rivals in the same season for the first time in three years.

I agree with Horn Brain – no matter what no pollster can take away the fact that we beat OU head to head.

by ellayhorn on Nov 23, 2008 1:25 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Disappointing, but true

I hate to be in this position, but chaos seems to be more the exception than the rule. There is still much to be decided.

by racecarr on Nov 23, 2008 1:28 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Exactly

Start printing the “2008 Texas Football National Champions, Damnit” T-shirts the second we win our bowl game if all of this works out.

by Horn Brain on Nov 23, 2008 1:28 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You did....

You did beat OU this year. Congrats are in order. No doubt it was a great accomplishment. Out of 10 games, how many would UT win is not known, but on that day you beat OU fair and square.

Sadly, UT did not do enough to win the South outright. No KC trip, and no BCS CG for you…

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:30 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

you dont need kc

to be in the NCG discussion. See OU 2003 and NEbraska 2001….and Texas 2008

by kriess on Nov 23, 2008 1:32 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If you pass us...

… and IF (BIG IF) you don’t choke in the national championship game, we will be AP national champions with a bowl win. In that case, there’s a State Fair in Dallas for deciding such disputes. See you there.

by Horn Brain on Nov 23, 2008 1:35 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The only team that i’ll believe has truly done enough to be an unquestioned national champion is Alabama, if they beat Auburn, Florida, and whatever Big 12 team they face in the title game.

Barring that, this season’s headed for a split title.

by APinAustin on Nov 23, 2008 1:33 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

How does beating Auburn make anything legitimate?

Auburn sucks. Auburn lost to Arkansas. Alabama did beat Georgia, but what has Georgia really done?

by GhostofBigRoy on Nov 23, 2008 1:36 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Actually

Actually, it’s not me….

It’s the Coaches. It’s also the Harris’ voters (who I believe will also vote OU ahead of UT, but we’ll see). But you can bank on the computers also voting OU ahead of UT if not this week then definitely next week after beating OSU, due to the SOS.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:37 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

39-33

Is a worse loss by Texas than OU’s loss.

Especially after last night’s drubbing.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:39 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Why would the sooners even want to go to a BCS game?

We all know they’re going to choke when they get there. At least Texas would represent the Big 12 well.

by ctex80 on Nov 23, 2008 1:42 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The only reason OU should go to a BCS game

Jim Ross and OU kids crying on the big stage.

by seth78 on Nov 23, 2008 1:45 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Location, location, location

What’s OU’s best road win? Considering the circumstances, 39-33 in Lubbock at the end of the gauntlet UT ran is not a worse loss than a double-digit loss on a neutral field.

by racecarr on Nov 23, 2008 1:42 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

After next week

OU will have beaten OSU.

A team UT BARELY beat at home. BARELY.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:45 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And it was a last second loss

OU got thoroughly beaten by UT in the second half. That same team that looked so impressive last night got worked in the second half by UT.

by racecarr on Nov 23, 2008 1:43 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And SINCE that game

OU has developed their run game. Murray is not the same running back he was in October. Healthy, and fearless again, and finally over the injury.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:46 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Exactly

And the OU-UT game swung when Ryan Reynolds went out with his injury… he doesn’t get hurt, different ending….

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:49 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Reynolds didn't play offense either though.

Those 2nd half 3 and outs by the OU offense wouldn’t have gone away.

by ajax77777 on Nov 23, 2008 2:31 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Oh please, Ryan Reynolds was the difference?

Would he have been able to throw completions in the 4th? Because Bradford couldn’t complete anything.

by the1austin on Nov 23, 2008 2:39 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Using the injuries argument

does nothing for OU considering Texas’ only loss, on the road to Tech, was a close game in which our best offensive player (Quan Cosby) and best defensive player (Brian Orakpo) only played in limited action…

the man, the myth, the legend.

by JYarbs on Nov 23, 2008 1:48 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Screwed

Texas cannot win the TTU argument.

The more you berate TTU, the more terrible the loss to them looks.

The more you praise TTU, the more OU’s complete demolition of them helps OU.

There’s no way out of for UT

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:44 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You're obviously a homer...

… and so I (and hopefully the rest of the board) is done with you. You just spout the same stuff over and over. No argument you make regarding these three teams can’t be used against you in the same way. Ignoring you now.

by Horn Brain on Nov 23, 2008 1:51 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

so...

what exactly happens to UT’s 45-35 argument if OU loses on saturday in stillwater? will you guys be lobbying for tech to be ranked ahead of you? they have the head to head after all, and you guys will have identical records (assuming tech beats baylor).

by kbd on Nov 23, 2008 3:43 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

ps

and if you’re gonna somehow argue in that scenario how texas should be ranked ahead of tech, please provide what UT will have done to change 39-33 – since you guys claim OU hasn’t done anything to change 45-35.

by kbd on Nov 23, 2008 3:45 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

simple...

Tech got beat by 40 odd points while our only loss was on a last second play. Hard to argue that.

by jw4425 on Nov 23, 2008 3:46 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

semantics.

by arguing that, you’re saying the type of loss (even factoring in the last second play angle) is more of a determining factor than head to head?

okay, so right now, OU has lost by 10 to a top 5 team away from home in a game they lead for most of the time (as long as we’re throwing in as many spin factors as possible). texas lost on the road to a team that got beat by 40 something. advantage: OU.

by kbd on Nov 23, 2008 3:49 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What??

Texas lost on the road to a top 10 team on the last play. OU lost by 10 points to a top 5 team on a neutral field. Advantage OU? I think not…

by jw4425 on Nov 23, 2008 3:55 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

you’re arguing texas is better than tech, but you’re saying OU’s loss against texas is worse than texas’ loss to tech? are you really putting that much emphasis on neutral/road? are you 12?

by kbd on Nov 23, 2008 4:04 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

neutral/road aside...

We won by 10 and shut OU out in the 4th quarter. Despite playing the worst half of our season, we were a dropped interception from beating Tech (yes, in Lubbock). Any way you look at it, Tech is still a top 10 team, and our loss is still better, yes. Texas is better than Tech, but we also beat OU more convincingly than Tech beat us. Even a 12 year old could understand that logic…

by jw4425 on Nov 23, 2008 4:09 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Voters don't go by logic

They prefer teams to pile it on even though the winning team already had the game won by the end of the first half.

by seth78 on Nov 23, 2008 4:13 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

yeah

i’m sure the 9-point difference in the second half was the deciding factor.

by kbd on Nov 23, 2008 4:34 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

a ridiculous argument.

OU fans could easily argue that we played our worst half against texas as well. does that negate OU’s loss as well?

your argument is ridiculous. you say texas is better than OU (despite OU looking more impressive lately) because they beat OU (in a game where OU played their worst half). you say texas is better than texas tech because texas tech lost by 40 something. you argue texas’ loss to a team that they are better than is worse than OU’s loss to a team that is better than them.

by kbd on Nov 23, 2008 4:18 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i never said...

it negated our loss. but even if that isn’t considered at all (which it probably shouldn’t be) a last second loss will always be better than getting beat by 10 and going scoreless in the 4th quarter.

look, if you wanna go on another team’s blog and try to stir people up that’s fine. i understand that since we beat you on the field, rhetoric is really the only way you can try to claim OU is better than Texas.

by jw4425 on Nov 23, 2008 6:05 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i’m not trying to stir people up, i came on here to ask the question in my original post and i’m still looking for the answer.

by kbd on Nov 23, 2008 6:34 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

the answer is...

OU and Texas’s resumes are pretty similar, but we won the head to head so should get the nod. Texas and Tech’s resumes are NOT similar, because Tech got bent over in Norman, hence Texas should get the nod. It’s pretty obvious.

by jw4425 on Nov 23, 2008 6:54 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i'll make it simple

Texas > Tech
Last second road loss > 10 point neutral field loss

You can argue how much to weight each one, but I think a last play loss to a top 10 team on the road will and should always look better than how OU lost in Dallas.

by jw4425 on Nov 23, 2008 4:12 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

so...

how is texas better than tech? again, going back to the original post of this topic, what has texas done to erase the 39-33 loss, considering OU hasn’t done enough in texas’ eyes to erase the 45-35 loss.

by kbd on Nov 23, 2008 4:19 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

well for starters...

Pounding Mizzou and destroying a KU team in Lawrence that hung 35 on your defense in Norman…

by jw4425 on Nov 23, 2008 6:05 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

mizzou has done nothing this year. the

who cares about kansas? seriously? they’re 6-5 and well on their way to 6-6. they put up 31 on OU’s defense, a touchdown with a minute left in the game. keep in mind that game OU was trying to find a way to replace reynolds and started nic harris at linebacker that game. obviously, they ditched that plan after the game. OU played noticeably flat against KU and still the game was never really in serious doubt. if that’s your big common opponent argument to counter OU, you’re in trouble lol.

by kbd on Nov 23, 2008 6:45 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

just another common opponent...

to add to a list that should be irrelevant because we beat you. does it feel weird to lobby so hard against a team that beat you?

by jw4425 on Nov 23, 2008 6:52 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Agreed -- there's plenty of football left to be played.

…but as fans, what can we do aside from root like hell on Thursday and pray on Saturday?
Email writers and pollsters and such?

by HornPride on Nov 23, 2008 1:37 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Look at it this way...

Say Ohio State had beaten Penn St. So they would be 11-1 and USC would be 11-1. Ohio State would be conference champs, USC would not. Could you argue that Ohio State would deserve a National Title shot over USC?

by ctex80 on Nov 23, 2008 1:45 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not a reasonable comparison

Because they don’t play similar opponents….

OU and UT did.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:47 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So.....

So, according to your argument, you should reward the team that played the inferior schedule (like Texas did) and lost to the inferior opponent (like Texas did)………

In your matchup which I still don’t think is comparable to the OU-UT argument since they did not play similar opponents, even though I agree that USC was shown out as the better team when they played, you cannot reward them for their overall season when for the reasons I stated above……

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:52 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

maybe...

if Texas played an inferior schedule. I would love for you to show me a computer system that shows OU’s schedule was harder than Texas’. I mean, if OU played a stronger schedule, wouldn’t unbiased computers recognize that? Well, every computer ranking I have seen has Texas’ strength of schedule at #2. OU’s seems to be somewhere in double digits. And I can almost guarantee the guys who have created the formulas that go into the computer rankings are far more intelligent than you or I. So I can’t see where your argument holds water.

by mrbubbles812 on Nov 23, 2008 1:59 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What you've been looking at....

Hasn’t included the last two games on OU’s schedule….

Factoring in TTU and OSU, yes, their SOS will be above UT’s.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 2:00 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Maybe, but it will be damn close,

and shouldn’t be enough to offset head to head. They will both have top 10 schedules.

by ctex80 on Nov 23, 2008 2:00 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not that close

I haven’t seen OU’s strength of schedule get above #26. And why is it that SOS lags two weeks? Can you explain that?

by mrbubbles812 on Nov 23, 2008 2:03 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I respect your frustration

The 3-way tie is maddeningly unfair, with reasonable criteria for all….

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 2:04 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It won't be that close

Look at the current Sagarin ratings after yesterday’s games: http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/fbt08.htm

UT is #1, OU is #2, but a very slim margin. UT will get nothing from beating #94 A&M at home, whereas OU will pick up a ton of points for beating #12 OSU on the road… Will be a big leapfrog to #1 SOS.

Plus, this will give OU 6 top 30 games, and Texas only 4….

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 2:13 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Nothing? Whoa, hoss. This "who is hot" crap will be neutralized.

In addition, every statement that is being made is pointing out the fallibility of the BCS.

The BCS masters may say any publicity is good, the fact is this is occurring precisely because there is no suitable resolution when there are many teams in the race in the last weeks.

I can not emphasize how fucking stupid it is to be arguing about tenths and hundredths, if not thousandths, of a point. This is tribalism and propaganda, not football at all.

by whills on Nov 23, 2008 2:21 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Where the heck are you looking at SOS with Sagarin?

UT’s SOS is #5; OU’s is #26— 21 spots lower! You either can’t read the rankings or are just a troll who chooses to ignore the very things he brings up!

by ajax77777 on Nov 23, 2008 2:40 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

"Unbiased" is not entirely true here.

I think it is generally true that Texas has played a tougher schedule than OU. Of course, if OU beats OSU and Mizzou, that might change.

But the computer ratings are far from unbiased, and by “unbiased” I mean free from all bias. It has long been shown that you cannot observe or measure something without affecting the outcome. This is also true when people create algorithms to determine what football teams are the best. The people behind the computer ratings still have to pick and choose what criteria to use. What criteria they do use reveals their biases. So, none of the computer ratings are unbiased. They might be less biased than voters, but eliminating bias altogether is impossible.

by mnHorn on Nov 23, 2008 2:07 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Objectively

OU has the look. They make explosive plays, they run the ball, they just beat a pretty good TT team.

We as Texas fans know that Texas has achieved a whole lot this season, possibly overachieving a bit. However, Texas might not be ready anyway. Bradford is talented and does what he needs to. He has iglesias, broyles, gresham and johnson. He takes his pick where he wants to go. The O-line is gigantic, the running game is potent(murray, Brown) racking up well over 200 yd rushing a game. On defense the secondary and linebackers are adequate, while the d-line is talented and deep (missing starters lastnight).

Texas is good, we all know this. We just arent sexy enough. We dont have the huge passing plays, we dont break a run for 50-60 yards very often. We get bogged down once in a while.

Go ahead OU you want it soo bad, go to theBCS/MNC game. Try not to embarrass the big 12 this time, can you do that ?

by owenh on Nov 23, 2008 1:52 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I said...

I said in this site yesterday, I’d grudgingly root for UT to go on and win in the BCS if that’s how it turned out. McCoy in particular has earned my respect, and I’ll be happy for him if he wins the Heisman, for it will be deserved.

I would hope that our conference partners would root for us, just as we did the Rose Bowl.

Say all you want about prior years. This team is this team, period.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:55 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The problem is

that “has the look” is a subjective thing, no matter what. Remember 2006, the year the pollsters got their education on arguing “the look.”

by Gator Cub on Nov 23, 2008 1:56 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

But it sooooo is...

Texas Tech is completely out of it, the way the voters have voted. What they’re doing is using the the three way tie as an excuse to ignore head to head against the only two teams that anyone cares about. Blinded by shiny things.

by Horn Brain on Nov 23, 2008 1:59 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

TTU is out of it????

If OU loses to OSU, then TTU STILL goes to KC, and NOT UT…. So, TTU is NOT out of it….

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 2:01 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Tech is out of the MNC talk...

Agreed Tech can still make it to KC, but they’re no longer in the running for the MNC.

by HornsFaninCalifornia on Nov 23, 2008 2:03 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If only

You hadn’t also lost 33-39. It also bears repeating. And obviously the nation noticed and remembers.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 1:59 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

if only

you hadn’t lost 45-35 my friend we wouldn’t be discussing this

by BlinkOneGun on Nov 23, 2008 2:15 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And

I tip my hat to UT for that victory. Better team won that day.

Play 10 times, I think OU wins 6, but they only play once.

Well. Unless Auburn or Fla State help us out and make January REALLY fun.. :)

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 2:16 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ou looks good now but it will be interesting to see how sexy Texas looks Thursday after a bye week..

We looked as good as OU did last night against Mizzou. At Tech we were flat but stayed in it. Kansas was a good win. I thought McCoy got beat up too much against Baylor. It will be interesting to see if we look like the team we were in October before Tech and the four game run.
I know A&M sucks but you can never count out the rivalry factor so it won’t be all about them being horrible if we look good Thursday.

by mtntrance on Nov 23, 2008 2:11 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

LOL

John Hunt has USC 4th, Penn State 5th, Ohio State 6th and Texas 7th. Well done.

by JohnsonUT on Nov 23, 2008 2:48 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

John Hunt

There’s an option to vote for the best/worst voter of the week. John Hunt was at 345 votes and first place for worst voter this week last I looked.

by UTexasCPA on Nov 23, 2008 5:18 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I’m rooting for the Horns, even though your homers have been spewing their hate since last night on our boards. Any team from Texas is better than OU. I know you don’t want to hear this, but the team that kicked the ever-loving shit out of us is not the same team that went to Dallas. I’m just hoping you’re not the same team that came to Lubbock. Or that played OSU. But I’m still a believer in head to head. You beat them fair and square and that SHOULD be the end of discussion.

by TT_ on Nov 23, 2008 2:49 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Hunt

is the sole reason why we’re behind OU

by kriess on Nov 23, 2008 2:50 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So....

Texas is No. 4 in Harris and OU No. 3……nice. The mantra of the pro-BCS is that there is a playoff every week and its decided on the field. Apparently they are wrong once again.

by Horns82 on Nov 23, 2008 2:50 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Last night on College Gameday Final

Lou Holtz Said this exact words “We should have Florida and Alabama play in the SEC Championship and Texas and OU play in the Big 12 Championship and then it will be decided”

I think a lot of people have forgot that we did play. And Texas won.

Adopt-a-recruit: Devon Kennard DE
Phoenix (AZ) Desert Vista 6'3" 257lbs

by blazzinken on Nov 23, 2008 2:52 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No

No, they played a regular season game. And then UT didn’t finish out and win the division.

Besides. Let’s play NOW.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 2:56 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Harris Poll

More bad news for UT. The Harris Poll was just released and OU jumped us.

http://www.harrisinteractive.com/news/bcspoll.asp

by TexasEx01 on Nov 23, 2008 2:55 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not too bad

2. Florida 2,644
3. OU 2,598
4. Texas 2,577

by JohnsonUT on Nov 23, 2008 2:58 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

My BCS Projections

Now that we have both polls, it is much easier to project the BCS numbers.

Here is what I come up with
1. Alabama .9835
2. Texas .9302
3. Oklahoma .9218

Florida will be 4 but I’m less confident in their numbers. I have no idea how a win over the Citadel affects computer rankings.

--AW--

by awiggo on Nov 23, 2008 2:56 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No

I actually ran all the numbers in a spread sheet. If I’m wrong on a couple of computer rankings, then OU could easily be #2.

Both polls are out so that is 2/3 of the numbers that are set as is the Sagarin poll. I am only guessing on the other five computer rankings.

It will be close. Very close. Just changing a few computers numbers makes is Tx .9269 and OU .9252

I’m assuming that you have also run the numbers. Please email me what you’ve got so that we can compare.

--AW--

by awiggo on Nov 23, 2008 3:01 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The point is...........

The point is that this week’s computer rankings aren’t THAT important. NEXT week OU will jump up big time, and UT will not. So even if UT has a slim lead this week, which at this point I doubt, they won’t next week.

by TexasSooner on Nov 23, 2008 3:04 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Just caught an error

New projected numbers

1. Alabama .9805
2. Texas .9242
3. Oklahoma .9225

Too close to call without more of the computer rankings. I am only projected the rankings for today not what they will be if OU and Texas both win next week.

--AW--

by awiggo on Nov 23, 2008 3:06 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Projections

Texas .97
OU .93

--AW--

by awiggo on Nov 23, 2008 3:11 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So...

a first place vote and three second place votes (disregarding the outliers)?

by Sweed4Heisman on Nov 23, 2008 3:13 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Computers

Texas two first place votes, a second, and a third. (Throwing out a first and a third)

OU two second place votes, a third, and a fourth. (Throwing out a first and a fourth).

Changing the numbers by just one puts OU over the top.

--AW--

by awiggo on Nov 23, 2008 3:16 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No problem

I just hope that I’m right. Texas will need help this next week regardless of whether we hold onto No. 2 in the BCS this afternoon. An OU win on the road over Ok State will be seen by the computers as much more impressive than a Texas victory at home over the Aggies. Any computer advantage that we have now will likely be wiped away by next weekend.

If both teams win, it will come down to the human voters in both polls. Does Texas deserve to be ranked over OU because they beat the Sooners on a neutral field or does OU deserve to be ranked ahead of Texas despite the nuetral field loss based on two solid non-conference victories, a beat down of Tech, and a strong finish to the season?

I know which way we all lean but we need the voters as well.

--AW--

by awiggo on Nov 23, 2008 3:24 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No

the point is…

You were just pwned by AW, and need to go back to your crimson and cream cave.