Mack Brown got what he wanted
by Longhorn1214 on Dec 1, 2008 4:13 AM CST
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PrintYou people kill me. OU is ranked higher this year for one reason and one reason only. OU runs up the score. OU has always run up the score. OU will always run up the score. That's one of the many reasons why OU sucks.
Mack Brown got exactly what he asked for when he opted for integrity and sportsmanship over flash and media hype...second place. Everyone in the Big 12 voted for this BCS tiebreaker, so stop whining over spilled milk. It sucks, but you live with your choices. We all knew this was coming. Why? Because no one gives a damn about what happens in October. Coaches and sportwriters have the memory span of a gnat. You will always have to hit them between the eyes with a 2x4 to get their attention. It's strictly, 'What have you done for me lately?' and it always will be. Losing by one second on the road doesn't matter. If UT hadn't had a flat first half in Lubbock, if Colt hadn't thrown the interception, if we'd only held on to a game-ending interception we let slip through our fingers, if only we'd tackled Crabtree,... if only... then there would be no discussion.
Until UT decides to ground opponents into the dirt at every opportunity, play without mercy by leaving their starters in for all 4 quarters, and basically play like the local bully on the block (in other words, like OU), then not give a damn about whether anyone likes it or not, we're going to keep getting this result. We're stuck with the BCS for another 4 years given ESPN's new $125MM contract. So what are the chances OU will vote to reform the 5th tiebreaker (BCS) when it's benefitted them? HAH! Texas will have to beat their Fiesta Bowl opponent by 70 points to get any attention at all. The bad news is, this will hurt what could have been another monster recruiting year. The really bad news is the seniors got screwed. Sorry 'bout that Rak.
I'm so sick of Kirk Herbstreit lying about being in UT's corner the whole time that I could puke. I've heard nothing out of his mouth for 2 weeks but OU this, OU that. Go Tigers! I hope the Tigers embarrass OU on National TV and screw up everything. Go Bama! Beat Florida and kick OU's collective butts so badly that everyone will forget completely about the monster season the Big 12 had and fawn all over the SEC (again) like this year was all about them. Maybe then, the members will get together next spring and say, "Hey, wait a minute..." By the way, Colt's Heismann chances just went to zero. Maybe next year.
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Forgive me for repeating myself, but...
Although your post may sound a little extreme or bitter, it unfortunately is true. Running up the score is like negative political ads, people say they don’t like it, but it works for the most part. You are also right that an early season loss is too quickly forgotten and forgiven. But like it or not, Mack wants to be loved by everyone, including the other coaches, so he won’t run up the score. Obviously that doesn’t work either, as we can see how much "love’ his peers gave him in the coaches polls vis a vis Stoops. The one thing I would add to your post, which I’ve said several times recently, is that to the extend Brown has control or influence over the OOC schedule, he also got what he wanted there. In fact, it was the weak OOC schedule that screwed us in the computers, as they don’t consider MOV. Arkansas was unexpectly weak this year, but Rice has traditionally been so weak and plays such as weak schedule itself that even 9 wins this year couldn’t get it into the Top 25. Replace UTEP and/or Fla. Atlantic with teams like Boston Collge, Ga Tech, FSU, Va Tech, Minn, Northwestern, LSU, etc., and we’d most likely be ranked over OU at this point. It is too hard to get through our conference without a conference loss, thus you need a solid OOC SOS to stand a chance against other 1-loss schools. If you expect to claim the MNC, you shouldn’t be afraid to schedule decent OOC teams. I hope this year puts an end to UT’s tendency to schedule schools like Idaho Potato Tech and North-South-East-West Florida (and then expect us to pay $75 to see this).
"Only angry people win football games." --DKR
Expect the weak OOC schedule to hurt us again next year.
I've been fuelin' my dreams eatin' greens and beans.
Karma
I, for one, don’t want us running up the score John Jenkins style. What comes around goes around and OU will get theirs. Would we have stayed on top of OU if we scored 2 more tds against a&m, baylor and kansas? I doubt it.
As for strength of schedule, I’m on the record as saying that there is very little to be gained for a school like Texas by playing and tough OOC schedule. In hindsight, if we had played Boston College instead of FAU, would that have helped? I’m sure, but we did play a tougher schedule than OU did – all of the computers agree on that. The difference between us and OU in the computers is miniscule. This was just a matter of the pollsters forgetting what happened 6 weeks ago and things falling exactly wrong for us.
SOS
I am not sure we still had a better SOS after Missouri and Colorado lost this past weekend. The fact that the computers rated OU higher than us, despite 45-35 and equal records, suggests it was an SOS issue. Again, I am not arguing we should schedule Ohio State, LSU, and USC in the same year, but if we are afraid to schedule respectable “middle of the road” teams, like Tenn, BC, FSU, Utah, Oregon, Oregon State, Northwestern, Virginia, Va Tech, Georgia Tech, Illinois, etc., because they might beat you, then you have no reason to think you deserve a MNC. The arguement for a weak OOC schedule is usually that the Big 12 is so tough, we don’t need to schedule good OOC teams. First, this year shows we do. Second, the very fact that the Big 12 is so tough, means it is hard to escape undefeated. However, with one loss and a strong SOS we are in a much better position.
"Only angry people win football games." --DKR
SOS
Our SOS is still slighter higher (tougher) than OU according to Sagarin, but they are pretty close now after we had a much higher SOS previously.
Texas: 12
OU: 17
I think we need at lest one good OOC game, not so much for the computers, but to make the voters feel better about voting us higher. For some reason voters always look to your OOC schedule regardless of how tough your own conference is. Given the current system we need one or two showcase OOC games if there is any comparison of strength of schedule going on in the voters’ minds.
Our SOS was fine
Look at Florida and Alabamas SOS, they aren’t blowing anybody away. More times than not, playing Mizzou and Colorado from the Big 12 North will give you two solid games. Colorado had a terrible year, and their loss to Nebraska, a team that OU beat, hurt us. The game that separated us from OU was the Mizzou game. We slaughtered them and thought that they would run the table after us. Kansas fucked us by beating Mizzou, thus taking away our biggest win that OU didn’t have. If Mizz and Colorado both win I think we are on our way to KC and Stoops is the one bitching.
You Cant blame Mack!!
We can blame Leach for voting Oklahoma number 1 and the other Big 12 coach who voted OU number 1!!!! I hope Mizzou embarrasses OU Saturday night!!! 45-35!!!
You can't blame Leach either.
I don’t like Leach, but how can you blame him to ranking OU #1 after watching them dismantle his team for 60 minutes? If he had said, “I am voting for UT,” wouldn’t that have sounded like sour grapes?
"Only angry people win football games." --DKR
I can blame him for voting for OU over UT or Bama, yes.
by burntorangehorn on Dec 1, 2008 11:40 AM CST up reply actions
Do you really think
if UT had added a touchdown (assuming they could have) to every win (excluding OU and OSU, where the starters actually DID play 4 quarters), that it would have made the difference?
I think more than anything else, it just came down to who played who and when. If you flip the OU and Tech games with the same results (UT coming off a loss and rattling off big wins against Mizzou, OSU, then #1 OU), no doubt UT is gliding to the finish atop the division. Sucks, but I think that’s the biggest factor and unlike evil running up of scores or poor OOC scheduling, there’s nobody we can be pissed about for it.
Hey
The voters came back to us, we won the human polls as we should have. Blame Missouri and Colorado for not holding their ground against Kansas and Nebraska respectively…
Barry Switzer is a moron
Even his Super Bowl win was bogus; that was all Jimmy Johnson’s team, and the players will say so.
by TheElusiveShadow on Dec 1, 2008 10:56 AM CST up reply actions
This is ridiculous
I’m glad Mack is classy. I’m glad he didn’t vote Texas #1 and leave OU off the ballot. I’m glad he doesn’t rub scores in people’s faces.
It’s just a game, at the end of the day. He’s a football coach but also a teacher of young men. Yes, we could have scored 50 on Kansas and 60 on A&M. So what? If the voters are so stupid that they are swayed by that, then the system is really jacked up and that’s not Mack’s fault.
How many coaches have more than one crystal ball? Count ‘em… ZERO. Mack has one, like every other coach who has won. LSU has two BCS wins, but Miles has only one (Saban the other). Of course, the way it’s looking now, somebody is going to get two (Stoops, Meyer, or Saban). Or us.
by TheElusiveShadow on Dec 1, 2008 10:59 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
The voters ARE that stupid. The system IS really jacked up.
Oh wait…are we talking college football or the American electorate over the past 232 years?
by burntorangehorn on Dec 1, 2008 11:42 AM CST up reply actions
I'm glad Mack is classy, too.
But I regret that he didn’t leave OU off the ballot and vote the Horns #1. We deserved to go. This is a bigtime screwjob. The upside is that I’ll dance on Switzer’s grave when Tebow and company hang 70 on an overrated Land Title Thief Squad
"Stats are for losers, I like winning games"
". . .switzer is a cracked out bitch . . ."-osu poster
He should have voted us #1.
If Mack really believed UT should be in the conference championship game, he indeed should have voted us #1. If he didn’t believe that, then why the recent campaigning making just that case? He is not a bigger man or a better sport because his “modesty” preventing him from voting for his own team. Do you think Obama voted for McCain?
"Only angry people win football games." --DKR
No, he shouldn't have
Do I think we have the best team in the country? Yes. Do we have the best resume right now? No, we don’t. That goes to ’Bama, who remains undefeated. Those people who also gave votes to OU and Florida are morons. That Harris poll voter who gave us one should not have either.
Mack was just being honest. I would expect nothing less.
by TheElusiveShadow on Dec 1, 2008 2:45 PM CST up reply actions
only problem with that...
is – where does it say the team with the best resume should be ahead? There is NO set criteria for voting. I bet if you got all the Harris voters and all the coaches and interviewed them (preferably hooked up to a polygraph…) and asked them what criteria they used to decide their rankings, you’d get dozens of different answers.
Some vote on who they think is the “best”, some on “resume”, most on some weird personal mix of the two… Pellini obviously votes based on who he played… not sure if that meant he left every team he didn’t play off his ballot, but his quote doesn’t indicate a level of intelligence (or at least seriousness) that would preclude such incredible foolishness. At any rate – nobody’s really even in agreement as to what exactly they’re voting for. One more reason it might, just might, be preferable to decide such things on a field…
Anyway, I completely disagree that it would have been wrong for Mack to put Texas as number one and completely leave OU out. It’s a completely bogus poll anyway, and to use it as a decision basis for the opportunity to play for a conference title – especially when the eventual outcome means two teams you beat by double digits will play for it – is just wrong. So what if you abuse your vote? If it leads to busting up the whole concept of coaches voting on teams they have very little knowledge or familiarity with, so much the better…
Better to err on the side of doing justice to your boys than to err on the side of keeping a thin veneer of legitimacy on a completely illegitimate process.
Respectfully Disagree
If it was in Mack’s power to put our team in the championship, where they belong, he should have done it. There is no dishonor in skewing the statistics in your favor. The BCS is a broken system, gaming it is a necessary evil, and doing so doesn’t make anyone less “Classy”.
"Stats are for losers, I like winning games"
". . .switzer is a cracked out bitch . . ."-osu poster
If Mack did leave OU off the ballot
then he would have sunk to Stoops’ level and we all know that he would rather step down as UT head coach than give up his morals. Year after year it’s the same thing from him, “We will go where they put us” and no matter if he strongly disagrees he will make damn sure that his team not only shows up and plays hard whether it’s a BCS bowl or the Holiday Bowl but they will play with class. That’s why we’re Texas and not OU.
You're ignoring a few things
FACT: Our computer average is what cost us the most
FACT: Margin of victory is not accounted for in the computers
OU did not gain points in the computers by that last unnecessary TD. They passed us up because of a very good ROAD win to a top 15 team, something we don’t have on our resume. Also, Mizzou losing and Nebraska winning cost us dearly in the computers.
Mack Brown running up the score like a classless jerk WOULD NOT have gotten us to the MNC.
by goingforthecorner on Dec 1, 2008 3:07 PM CST reply actions
However
Fact: OU had jumped us in the polls earlier
Fact: A larger margin in the polls, which many argued we should have had if the voters did the right thing, would have gotten us the Big 12 title berth.
We know the computer scores got us too. But we also feel more pollsters should have voted in our favor. In other words, we don’t think there’s any reason why we only came out +5 in the human votes. Obviously, OU impressed a lot of people by posting 60 points several times.
by TheElusiveShadow on Dec 1, 2008 3:21 PM CST up reply actions
wrong, wrong, wrong...
it would not have made a difference in the computers, but if it changed the mind of one or two coaches/harris voters, we would have gone regardless…
Let’s face it, we made up a lot of ground, but a whole lot of people still voted OU over us, and we are still behind in the coaches’ poll. And the only reason is that voters decided running up the score trumped a head-to-head and a decidedly tougher schedule… If we’d run scores up into the 50’s and 60’s against teams late when we had a clear opportunity to do so, we would have bled some of the wow! factor away from OU. Especially when the defensive side of the score was so much more impressive than OU has been putting up…
Back in the Royal Days!!
When DKR was coach, we hardly ever passed. To quote Coach Royal, “If you pass there are three things that can happen and two are bad!” Back then we won with scores in the teens and twenties. I think in 1963, when we won our first national championship, the highest score of the season was against Navy, 26-10. And in that game we did pass.
Within a year or two, Univ. of Houston ran up the score on a hapless team, 100-0. Every school in the US came out against Houston’s “Style Points”. And that is the way it should be. Style points is synonymous with unsportsman like conduct!!!
But as I said in another thread, I would love to see us rip Tech and OU for 70-0 scores next year and then be sportsmen in the rest of the games.
100-6
The only reason I know this off the top of my head is that, during the Houston-Tulsa game a couple of weeks ago, Houston was scoring at a pace, deep into the third quarter, that made 100 plausible. I looked up when the last 100 point game was, and, ironically, it was Houston against Tulsa, 40 years earlier. Houston scored 49 in the 4th quarter of that game!
You are correct however......
I dont dislike Stoops
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