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Bevo's Daily Roundup - Big 12 Media Day Two

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Big 12 Media Days: Day Two

Star-divide

 

You can watch Media Day video on the Big 12 Conference site.

 

Missouri

Gary Pinkel on replacing Chase Daniel:

At the conclusion of spring football, Blaine Gabbert was far and away the best quarterback at that particular time. We had two freshmen that came in, Ashton and Blaine. Ashton Glaser and Blaine Dalton came in early, which allowed them really to get spring football in, learn our system and the process, and they did really well. I expect them to be significantly better, naturally after going through it, as we go into two-a-days.

Gary Pinkel knows there are high expectations for Missouri. No excuses.

"I don't think any of our fans really care how young we are or how inexperienced we are," Pinkel said during Big 12 Media Days on Tuesday. "They expect a good football team."

 

"Definitely. We had six guys get drafted,
those guys from other teams, I don't care if they all would have left,
they probably wouldn't have had six guys drafted. And we could have had
more than six. I put my teammates up against anybody, that's just how I
am, if I go to war with you every day, I'm going to ride with you."
— Missouri linebacker Sean Weatherspoon,
when asked if he said Missouri was the most talented team in the Big 12

 

 

Baylor

Baylor is being taken seriously for three reasons Jason Smith, Art Briles and Robert Griffin. Are they serious about winning?

"We have a chance to have a really solid defense, which you must have to win our (South) division."

Baylor thinks it can win the South Division? Yes, and the Bears aren’t joking.

Athlon Sports put Robert Griffin on 2009 Heisman watch list.

Is Griffin overexposed?

One writer asked Baylor coach Art Briles if the attention Griffin has received could hamper the progress of the team, to the point where he might be overexposed.

"The good thing about Robert is that he’s not a guy who seeks it out," Briles said. "Our players respect him for what he does on and off the football field. He’s the guy that, I’ve said it before, he’s used to having people look at him when he walks into a room, and it just didn’t start now. So as far as talking about him being overexposed, well, I hope that’s the case. I hope it’s a deal where he solidifies that kind of exposure."

The Bears are looking for some solid production from wide receiver David Gettis.

David Gettis arrived in the Baylor program as the most-heralded recruit in the program's recent history.

Gettis has struggled living up to those expectations, producing only one touchdown reception in his three-season career with the Bears and no touchdown grabs since his freshman season.

"David is a guy at this stage of his career is not to talk but produce," Baylor coach Art Briles said. "We've done enough talking and hoping and hyping. But let's start doing results and believing in it."


"There is a buzz in Waco." — Baylor linebacker Joe Pawelek, about the 
preseason excitement surrounding the Bears' program

"What he's done for Baylor on the national football scene, we're very
appreciative of. He hasn't done it though with what he's said; he's
done it with what he's done. That's how you make noise in the football
world." — Baylor coach Art Briles, on sophomore quarterback Robert Griffin



Kansas

Kansas coach Mark Mangino believes Kansas is on the way to becoming a consistently winning program.

Dezmon Briscoe is still in Mangino's doghouse.

Kansas wide receiver Dezmon Briscoe's playing status in the program is tenuous with preseason practice set for Aug. 6.

Kansas coach Mark Mangino told Kansas fans Sunday during a trip to the Kansas Museum of History in Topeka, Kan., that Briscoe still isn't assured of playing with the Jayhawks this fall.

Why doesn't Mangino particiapte in the coaches poll?

When asked, Mangino made the admission he doesn't vote in the coaches' rankings.

"One of the reasons why I don't is because I think it takes a lot of time," he said. "And I just don't feel good about taking a couple of hours every Sunday working on a poll when I should be getting my team ready to play."

 

"For us to really get where we want this program to be, we have to
start winning against teams that are considered the elite teams in the
league." — Kansas coach Mark Mangino, on his team taking the next step

"I've had to fight off naysayers my whole life. Sometimes I wish it
would quit. But I've shown a little bit that I can play a little
football here and there." — Kansas' Todd Reesing, about playing quarterback in college
despite being only 5-foot-11

 

 

Oklahoma

Sooner Sports had their own blog of OU's turn on the dais.

ESPN's Joe Schad reports on the Sooners and asks Sam Bradford about the offensive line.

When asked about the OU-UT tiebreaker controversy, Bob Stoops took a swipe at Texas.

But when Stoops stepped down from the podium, he couldn't resist one swipe at the air banners hired by Texas fans proclaiming the score of the OU-Texas game.

"They throw up the score of our game," Stoops said, "I'll throw up the score of the (Texas) Tech game."

The offensive line is still the biggest challenge for the Sooners.

With four new starters from last season, Oklahoma's offensive line is the biggest question coming into the season.

"Obviously, it's a concern because those guys have only played a limited amount," Oklahoma coach Bob Stoops said. "What you want to see is some kind of consistency and how they work through two-a-days and through the season. You're looking for a level of discipline and a level of toughness in how they work."

 

"It has a chance to be good. There's talent there and potential."
— Stoops, on OU's offensive line

"Before, our d-line wasn't a standout group.
Then we went against our offensive line, which was a standout group,
and that made us better. Now, we are the standout group,
they're going against us, so they're going to get better. That's why I'm not worried
about our offensive line." — Oklahoma defensive tackle Gerald McCoy

 

 

A few articles of interest...

Is there a big disparity in talent in the North and South Divisions?

Dr. Saturday asks when will the North rise again?

It seems the Big 12 South's season-long reign as "America's Division" survived the postseason flops after all -- even after Texas Tech and Oklahoma State were dispatched in eye-openeing second routs, Oklahoma dropped its fifth straight BCS game and Texas needed a last-minute comeback to stave off an upset at the hands of Ohio State (Todd Boeckman-led Ohio State!), the pollsters still love the South...

Those results speak for themselves. Since Kansas State's out-of-nowhere beatdown of Oklahoma in the 2003 championship game, the entire North division has managed to beat the Sooners once and Texas twice in 35 tries -- and all three wins were colossal upsets, at the hands of Kansas State (which won a turnover-marred game against Texas in '06 and shocked the Horns in Austin in '07) and Colorado (which secured Dan Hawkins' only notable win in Boulder by taking out Oklahoma in '07). The North has not come close to winning a conference championship game since KSU's triumph, and in fact hasn't been favored to win one since Nebraska beat Texas in 1999. Even Missouri, ranked No. 1 in both major polls in 2007, was a slight underdog to Oklahoma, and were trounced by three touchdowns.

ESPN's Mark Schlabach identifies his 2009 breakout stars.

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The news stories from today...

well, just stunk. Maybe some good stuff tomorrow.

by dimecoverage on Jul 28, 2009 7:45 PM CDT reply actions  

Look who you were covering

To be expected

"From the waist down, Earl Campbell has the biggest legs I have ever seen on a running back." -John Madden

by run Bevo run on Jul 29, 2009 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

And the 2008 Fiesta Bowl

and the 2007 Fiesta Bowl, and the 2005 MNC Orange Bowl

by future_longhorn_dad on Jul 29, 2009 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

And the 2004 Sugar Bowl

Heck, even the big game they won, the 2000 MNC game, was an atrocious display of football. They were lucky not to have played Miami.

by TheElusiveShadow on Jul 29, 2009 9:45 AM CDT up reply actions  

I have always found it funny

That OU has to use some other teams score to support their argument, as if the game that is played seems to not matter.

by future_longhorn_dad on Jul 29, 2009 9:47 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

am I the only one

seeing some quotes from players and coaches that look like they were posted in Word font?

by Beergut on Jul 29, 2009 5:52 AM CDT reply actions  

Word font?

Looks like Times New with fixed spacing — imitation typewriter.

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. If they get mad, you're a mile away AND you have their shoes.

by Caradoc on Jul 29, 2009 8:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

There appears to be a rhyme and reason.

Those gray boxes with the different font are quotes from media days, not clips out of articles. They look different in order to differentiate them.

by billyzane on Jul 29, 2009 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

ah, ok

just wanted to make sure it wasn’t my computer

by Beergut on Jul 29, 2009 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think I understand now.

Does your block quoting look correct on your computer? ;)

by gwh65 on Jul 29, 2009 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

And Sean Weatherspoon

obviously wasn’t paying attention when Oklahoma put their 41 point beatdown on Missouri in the Big 12 championship game last December.

Gerald McCoy, Jermaine Gresham, and Sam Bradford all would have been first round picks if they had come out early. Trent Williams was a likely first day pick, and DeMarcus Granger would have received some first day consideration. The Sooners had five players drafted, so that would make ten draft picks if everyone had gone pro. Missouri more talented? Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

by Beergut on Jul 29, 2009 5:59 AM CDT reply actions  

he’s a football player… who says they know shit about football?

by Displaced Longhorn on Jul 29, 2009 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Griffin for Heisman? I’d be happy if he made it to the ceremony this year, or even made the the Maxwell finalists or something. I have him and Reesing on my fantasy team, and I expect them each to be impact players on it, even if neither wins a ton of games.

by burntorangehorn on Jul 29, 2009 8:44 AM CDT reply actions  

Where do you play fantasy CFB?

I don’t know near enough (or care near enough) to get into NFL fantasy, but I’d really enjoy CFB fantasy. Mind sharing?

by TXinDC on Jul 29, 2009 9:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

I play a league where we’ve done the whole thing on an online bulletin board. We’ve been doing it for about six years or so, I believe, and it’s by far superior to what NFL fantasy football has become, which is a bunch of dudes using online guides and cheatsheets with very little skill involved.

However, a recent lawsuit has made it legal to use individual player names for commercial sites, so now CBS and others offer fantasy CFB leagues. I haven’t tried those yet, because I’m far to busy to bother with more than this one league. It’s nice because I’m the type of guy who likes to do his own homework, project his own sleepers and steals, etc. There’s also more turnover in CFB, which makes it an extra challenge.

If you want to see our league and possibly be on deck in case we have someone go absentee, let me know. We’re currently in the 14th round of a 24 round draft, and I don’t have a single Longhorn yet. Colt and Shipley were kept by other teams (I originally drafted Colt, but had to take a one-year hiatus that gave another guy control of my team, so I had to start basically from scratch), and they’re the only guys who are definite fantasy stars. I might pick up Collins, Gilbert, or Whaley as sleepers.

by burntorangehorn on Jul 29, 2009 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

i’d say pickup collins, pass on gilbert/whaley.

by Displaced Longhorn on Jul 29, 2009 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

Gilbert and Whaley would be strictly keeper picks, I think. Replacing Colt in the UT system would probably make GG a very attractive keeper.

by burntorangehorn on Jul 29, 2009 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

GG for keeper pick, I honestly dont do the fantasy sports thing, so I didn’t even think about that. I wouldn’t pick Whaley until he shows he can do something.

by Displaced Longhorn on Jul 29, 2009 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

Never done College Fantasy Football

But I wouldnt pick any Texas runner for the near future.

by BoddickerIsClutch on Jul 30, 2009 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

CFB Fantasy

I’ve never seen player-based fantasy college football (just pick ’ems), but it seems like you could really game the system by:

1. Signing mediocre players playing against D2 opponents at any given week of the season.
2. Drafting players in weak conferences but on a potent offense to take advantage of the lack of parity.

How does your league get around these problems, and where do you play?

by pleaseplaykindle on Jul 29, 2009 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

We play BCS conferences only, plus Notre Dame. Games against FCS and D2 schools count, of course, but it’d be hard to find enough starters to make that much of a difference except in one or two weeks. We get a maximum of 100 waiver points each year, and we submit blind bids for guys, minimum 5pts. per bid, so it’s not like you can keep picking up a waiver or three every week. Also, we cannot keep anyone picked up off waiver, even if we had the guy earlier in the season and picked him back up. A player must have been drafted and never cut in order to be kept, although he can have been traded to another team. And we only allow two keepers per team, and they must be at two different positions.

by burntorangehorn on Jul 29, 2009 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

Blaines

Missouri has two quarterbacks named Blaine? Are we out of Colts?

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. If they get mad, you're a mile away AND you have their shoes.

by Caradoc on Jul 29, 2009 8:54 AM CDT reply actions  

Y'know, at first I liked Baylor's little revival they had going

Robert Griffin really is a heckuva player and I hope to see him do some great things. Baylor deserves a little love given they’re the only private school in the Big 12.

That said – after Briles’ downvote of Texas in the final polls of last season; after the Bears’ poaching of one of our committed recruits (who has already moved on from the Bears, for better or worse); and after yesterday’s Media Day comments, it would appear to me that those Baptists are getting a bit big for their britches.

I hope Texas comes out a lot stronger against them this season than last, and make them realize what a joke it is to say that they’ll win the South. I’m sure it’s just a motivational tool, but Lordy, they haven’t been to a bowl game since 1994.

by TXinDC on Jul 29, 2009 9:09 AM CDT reply actions  

Absolutely. I’m all aboard the Griffin bandwagon, but I want Briles to be put in his place. Smack ‘em around by 50+ points and he’ll shut up. He might even wise up about his vote.

by burntorangehorn on Jul 29, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

They've reached the top of the hype bubble

No one is asking what happens if Griffin goes down – not that I’m endorsing that – but just noting that depth overall and especially at certain positions is Baylor’s Achilles’ heel. Their resurgence has been fun to watch, if only to see the aggies squirm.

I understand the push and the need to make the splash, but it’s all being done on the edge of a cliff. Baylor may have the prayer factor but they better be saving their breath.

by whills on Jul 29, 2009 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Stoops and Mangino

Mangino wants the Big 12 to “adjust” the schedule so they don’t play both OU and Texas in the same year. So what happens when OU and/or Texas (God forbid) is no longer the cream of the crop?!?! Does he want them to adjust again so they can play them both or adjust so they don’t play two strong teams from the South?!?!

What an idiot. You don’t hear Big 10 teams whining when they have to play both Ohio St and Michigan (under normal years). You don’t hear SEC teams whining when they have to play say LSU and Florida.

Stoops – I’ll keep it short and sweet: Big Game Douchebag. I hate that SOB with every fiber of my being.

by Go Bevo on Jul 29, 2009 9:09 AM CDT reply actions  

Whether it's perceived as whining or not...

there’s really no good reason not to adjust the scheduling every four years.

by hiphopopotamus on Jul 29, 2009 9:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

If Mangino wants to whine about that

I think it’s more fruitful discussion to redraw the lines and rethink the conference championship game so these North stragglers don’t get a shot at a conference title when the top 3 or 4 teams in the South are better than everyone they have.

by TheElusiveShadow on Jul 29, 2009 9:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

Why is Mangino Complaining about that?

It has obviously worked out in his favor before in ’07

by Frazier90 on Jul 29, 2009 3:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm amused how Stoops argues like that

Surely losing to Texas at a traditional neutral site is the same as beating a historically bad road team (really, name one big road game Leach has won) at home that defeated your rival at their place… a place that he has lost the last two times, by the way. Idiot.

by TheElusiveShadow on Jul 29, 2009 9:30 AM CDT reply actions  

I expected better coming out of Stoops

But, I guess when you live in Okie land long enough, you start to take some of their attributes

by future_longhorn_dad on Jul 29, 2009 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

Bad Road Team?

Texas Tech had 6,434 total yards (536.2 yards/game) in the 2008 season and averaged 44.6 points per game. Texas had 5,717 total yards (476.4 yards/game) and averaged 43.9 points per game. Of course they are “a historically bad road team”! They must have earned all those points and yards at home!
No wait! They must have unfairly “run up the score” on all those poor weaker opponents to make themselves look better statistically than Texas. Of course, they only ran up the score on these weak opponents at home.
Take another look at Texas Tech’s schedule in 2008 and tell me how they were a “bad road team.”

OU -- 7 National Championships; 6 Big 12 Championships; 5 Heisman Winners; Most winning college football program since WW2
UT--4 National Championships; 2 Big 12 Championships; 2 Heisman Winners
Nuff Said!

by Boomer S on Jul 29, 2009 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

they didn’t beat anyone away worth a shit, 4-4 in conference Kansas? their only losses were away from home. the previous year they didn’t beat anyone worthwhile away, only Baylor. the year before that they beat a decent A&M team.

they just don’t seem to play very well away from home.

by Displaced Longhorn on Jul 29, 2009 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

No difference b/w Tech on road games and at home!

Those four in coference losses were to OU, UT, Tech and Neb, and none of them can be characterized as a “whipping” except for the Tech game (at KU) and possibly the one at UT. When Tech played them they were #18. If you look at all of their away games they did outstanding while “away.” Look at the KSU and A&M games. The “historically bad on the road” argument doesn’t hold water when looking at the 2008 season. Give some credit where credit is due.

OU -- 7 National Championships; 6 Big 12 Championships; 5 Heisman Winners; Most winning college football program since WW2
UT--4 National Championships; 2 Big 12 Championships; 2 Heisman Winners
Nuff Said!

by Boomer S on Jul 29, 2009 3:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

The one at KU

not

possibly the one at UT.

was a whipping. KU (who was at home) barely had any offensive success except for a circus catch by Briscoe.

By the way, out of 5 away games I would say TT had 3 bad ones (A&M, Nevada, and OU). One ok game, KSU. And one good one KU.

At home (7 games) they had one terrible game. Baylor. I would place money on them having lost that game if it had been in Waco rather than Lubbock.

by ajax77777 on Jul 29, 2009 5:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

No kidding, future_longhorn_dad

Swing and miss, Boomer S.

“historically” = Having to with history.

And yet you answer:

The "historically bad on the road" argument doesn’t hold water when looking at the 2008 season.

As if we’re supposed to just look at 2008, and not you know, “history.”

But let’s play along, shall we:

Even if we did just look at 2008, as Displaced Longhorn said, they didn’t beat anyone of note. This is why I asked for somebody to name a big road game Leach has won in his tenure (you are welcome to give me an answer, and the win over Cal does not count because it was a neutral site). He has NEVER beaten OU or Texas on the road, and has no real signature road win. Someday he will if he stays long enough, but we have enough evidence to demonstrate that Tech has a tendency to only win their big games when they are in Lubbock. After all, as I stated, they’ve beaten OU the past two times in Lubbock. Away from Lubbock, we know how that turned out.

But instead of giving us a signature road win, you give us this:


Look at the KSU and A&M games.

Raise your hand if you think these are signature road wins. I wait in vain.

And you think Kansas only got “possibly” thrashed by UT? Again, a Sooner who evidently doesn’t watch the games and is like the ignorant voters who just look at the box score. Texas dominated Kansas. That 35-7 score could have been much worse, and that Kansas offense was almost SHUT OUT if not for a crazy helmet catch by Briscoe to convert a 4th down. A statement like that shows you need to watch more carefully.

I will most certainly give credit to where it’s due: Texas Tech had a great season. But their struggles to beat OU and Texas on the road are well-known, which is why they have never beaten both in the same season despite winning the last three of four against those two the last two years in Lubbock.

I am just curious at what you’re arguing at. I bring up Tech’s documented road struggles during Mike Leach’s tenure, and you bring up overall offensive stats throughout the entire 2008 season in an attempt to refute that. Again, swing and miss. Stttrrrriiiiike!

by TheElusiveShadow on Jul 29, 2009 3:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Simply Put, Texas Tech was a good road team in 2008

You “historically bad on the road” argument may make sense when justifying why OU losing to Texas on a neutral site is more decisive than OU beating a “historically bad” road team that beat Texas . You imply that OU had an advantage that Texas did not.

My argument is that simply looking at how they did against big teams on the road in the past “historically”, ignores how good they did during the 2008 season, and that the 2008 season shows that they did not live up to this “historical” trend. (They did beat #18 ranked Kansas—maybe not a win against a big team, but a whipping nonetheless. I considered a 42 point margin a whipping. And yes, Kansas was beat decisively by UT(at UT), I saw the game. Now a 28 point margin can be considered a “whipping” by some also. We are talking semantics.). Tech has not had a signature road game, but I’m sure Leach may prove otherwise. If you look at Texas Tech and their 2008 season, you will see that they played very well in their away games.

Getting back to the OU having an advantage that UT does not argument, I would like to point out that the OU win over Tech was over a big margin, despite Tech’s other road games. Could you honestly say that had Tech played UT at Austin, UT would have so decisively beat Tech like OU did? Just like you “decisively” beat Oklahoma State (at home) and Ohio State (bowl game?) That was the big question in many voters minds, and they sided with OU’s decisive win. This here v. away argument is given too much credit.

But no, ignore the 2008 statistics and how they show that Tech could have been legitimately shown to be a better team than Texas that season, and focus on this here v. away argument.

Hopefully, and I say this sincerely, we will not have the 2008 fiasco this season, and there will be no argument. You know it will be a legendary game Longhorn. LOL!

OU -- 7 National Championships; 6 Big 12 Championships; 5 Heisman Winners; Most winning college football program since WW2
UT--4 National Championships; 2 Big 12 Championships; 2 Heisman Winners
Nuff Said!

by Boomer S on Jul 29, 2009 5:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

The KU v UT was in Lawrence.

Kansas was beat decisively by UT(at UT), I saw the game.

I was at that game. So unless you can explain what I saw in Lawrence, KS. You’re wrong.

by ajax77777 on Jul 29, 2009 7:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

I stand corrected

I’ll admit on this site that I am wrong. My overall observation of Tech being a good road team in 2008 still stands.

OU -- 7 National Championships; 6 Big 12 Championships; 5 Heisman Winners; Most winning college football program since WW2
UT--4 National Championships; 2 Big 12 Championships; 2 Heisman Winners
Nuff Said!

by Boomer S on Jul 29, 2009 8:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

I am in no way ignoring the 2008 season

I’m looking at the totality of Leach’s resume in his tenure there. Look at Rickyspub’s stats below if you are interested.

You imply that OU had an advantage that Texas did not.

They did. It’s not rocket science. They got Tech at home and Texas did not. This doesn’t mean OU doesn’t deserve credit for winning. What it does mean is that Stoops’ retort is stupid because he’s trying to cover up the fact that he lost to Texas on a neutral site by beating a team at home who has a coach with a history of road struggles.

And yes, Kansas was beat decisively by UT(at UT), I saw the game.

I’m glad you have taken back your comment that none of Kansas’ conference losses were blowouts save the Tech game and “possibly” the UT game. The reason this game is a “whipping” is not because some people simply interpret 28 points as a dominating win. It’s HOW it happened. It’s not like it was 14-7 throughout three quarters, 21-7 at the middle of the fourth, and Texas happens to take two interceptions back for TD’s in the last two desperate Kansas drives. Texas was in control throughout and Kansas very nearly didn’t put a point on the board. Contrast that to the OU vs. OSU game. The final score showed a 20 point margin, leading many who just look at box scores to think OU dominated. Oklahoma State was in it throughout the game, and only some late scores finally sealed the deal, including a very meaningless touchdown to end the game.

Tech has not had a signature road game, but I’m sure Leach may prove otherwise. If you look at Texas Tech and their 2008 season, you will see that they played very well in their away games.

This makes no sense here. My argument is that Leach has shown throughout his tenure his inability to win big away games. You concede this, guarantee that it will happen (even I said he would if he stays long enough, but one upset win in the future isn’t going to erase all his past struggles), and then once again point to Tech’s road games in 2008 where they played nobody of note save Kansas, who turned out to be a product of lucky scheduling in 2007, and OU, in which they no-showed. Your arguments don’t even address the overall point.

However, since you INSIST on this 2008 business, I will show you why I am skeptical you watched Texas Tech throughout the season:

At Nevada: 35-19. Graham Harrell had a bad day, going 19/46 for 6.5 yards per attempt and 2 interceptions. At halftime, it was 14-9. At the middle of the fourth, it was 28-19. Only a touchdown at around the six minute mark for Tech put them ahead comfortably, but that’s still just two scores. This is Nevada we’re talking about.

At Kansas State: They whip K-State 58-28. Certainly deserve props for that, for no game is guaranteed, but… K-State finished 2-6 in conference and 5-7 overall. Not much to brag about.

At Texas A&M: Texas Tech was LOSING at halftime to one atrocious Aggie team. At the 7 minute mark of the fourth quarter, they were up by 11. Only a meaningless score with 2 seconds left did that margin go up to a deceptively easier 18 point win. A&M finished 2-6 in conference and 4-8 overall, and got wiped by Baylor.

At Kansas: The other Tech road blowout, whipping Kansas 63-21, as discussed before.

At OU: Well, I don’t have to mention this one, do I? Texas Tech should apologize for even traveling north.

So in five road games, they have two blowout wins against a bad team and a so-so team, an embarrassing loss against an elite team, and poor performances against two bad teams that they won by virtue of these teams being, well, bad. You want to call that an impressive road resume, then go ahead. Reasonable people will disagree, especially when coupled with Leach’s known history. Now, I will certainly credit Tech for winning, because even the likes of USC will flub up a road game, but like my argument states, Leach has established a pattern that he cannot consistently win on the road, especially against teams that are elite. Heck, add in the neutral site bowl game, and that just looks worse, but we’ll leave that out.


Could you honestly say that had Tech played UT at Austin, UT would have so decisively beat Tech like OU did?

Yes, I can. We wouldn’t have scored 65 because we don’t try to run up the score to fool idiot voters, but the main reason I was afraid of Tech was because we were going to Lubbock, where weird things often happen. Save 2003, Leach hasn’t kept many games competitive in Austin, no matter how highly ranked his team was (52-17 in 2005, anyone?).

Just like you "decisively" beat Oklahoma State (at home) and Ohio State (bowl game?)

You mean the bowl game that we won? Perhaps you have forgotten how that feels like, but it’s normally better than losing.

This here v. away argument is given too much credit.

Not by me. I was using that argument to show why Texas should have gone over OU. I was using that argument to show how stupid Stoops’ remark was. That’s it. If you want to talk about why Texas should have gotten more votes, than we can discuss that at length, and I’ll gladly talk about how our defense was superior to OU’s and the like. If any argument is given too much credit, it’s margin of victory, especially since many voters don’t even watch the games and just woodenly look at scoreboards.

But no, ignore the 2008 statistics and how they show that Tech could have been legitimately shown to be a better team than Texas that season, and focus on this here v. away argument.

Hey, keep ignoring the evidence, build straw men to attack, and live in your delusion that Stoops made some sort of clever remark by focusing on general statements about 2008, bare offensive stats with no context, and margin of victory. I guess I can’t expect any more critical thinking from a Sooner.

Strike two.

by TheElusiveShadow on Jul 29, 2009 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

“We wouldn’t have scored 65 because we don’t try to run up the score to fool idiot voters”
Hmmmm. I remember when you scored 70 points to Colorado’s 3 in the Big 12 Championship in 2005 (on your way to the national championship). But I suppose you are going to argue that you couldn’t help scoring on them and they sucked so bad (despite silly rankings!)

“You mean the bowl game that we won? Perhaps you have forgotten how that feels like, but it’s normally better than losing.”
You still had trouble with Oklahoma state at home (you did not address this observation), and you could have very well had trouble with Tech. Just consider the possibility, and don’t make the attack personal. You do have trouble with Big 12 Championships yourselves (I’m sure you will fully respond to this).

“Hey, keep ignoring the evidence, build straw men to attack, and live in your delusion that Stoops made some sort of clever remark by focusing on general statements about 2008, bare offensive stats with no context, and margin of victory. I guess I can’t expect any more critical thinking from a Sooner.”
The margin of victory you so brazenlty used in 2005 against Colorado. This is the pot callign the kettle black!!!!!!! And once again, you dismiss offensive stats without so much as acknowledging their validity and that you could have had just as hard a time with Tech at home! They were a great team in 2008. And this is your second personal attack with “I can’t expect any more critical thinking from a Sooner.”
I haven’t made it personal, have I?

OU -- 7 National Championships; 6 Big 12 Championships; 5 Heisman Winners; Most winning college football program since WW2
UT--4 National Championships; 2 Big 12 Championships; 2 Heisman Winners
Nuff Said!

by Boomer S on Jul 29, 2009 11:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

You are increasingly exposing yourself as somebody who doesn't watch games closely

And as somebody who does not know how to argue the issue at hand.

You still had trouble with Oklahoma state at home (you did not address this observation), and you could have very well had trouble with Tech. Just consider the possibility, and don’t make the attack personal. You do have trouble with Big 12 Championships yourselves (I’m sure you will fully respond to this).

Oklahoma State played us well. They also played OU well. The reason I did not address this observation but instead gamely replied that OU lost their bowl game was simply because it has NOTHING to do with the issue at hand. You were trying to make a case using margin of victory to justify OU moving into the Big 12 title game. As flawed as that is already, that wasn’t even the point I was making. The point I was making was to show how silly Bob Stoops’ answer was. The fact that you continue to miss this is just astounding. Go ahead and answer about Big 12 championships. Should I bring up NCAA violations? Other things that have nothing to do with the issues? You seem pretty good on going off on tangents to again, attack strawmen. The fact that you think this is personal is also laughable; I am nothing but amused by all this. Surely you should not be taking such playful jabs at rivals so seriously, no? But once again, keep attacking strawmen. It is always easier.

For the game against Colorado when it was 70-3, the Horns had 70 points about midway through the 3rd quarter. Texas scored nothing after that. Not only that, our backup QB was put into the game at just after the ten minute mark of the third quarter. We threw two times with him during that span for a grand total of 22 yards. Now let’s look at what OU did against Tech:

1. Sam Bradford was still in the game to start the fourth quarter. Not only that, OU was actively trying to score, throwing passes to start the fourth quarter and eventually scoring a touchdown to put them up 65-14.
2. Joey Halzle came in for OU’s last drive of the game, at about the 10 minute mark of the 4th. He threw four passes and OU actively tried to score, even trying to go for it on a fourth down at Tech’s goalline to push the lead over 70. They fell just short. These would be the only two possessions of the fourths since Tech kept the ball after that.

After the Horns scored their last TD, they had four possessions and didn’t score (and Vince Young was already out for that last TD, and the second to last TD was just one play since Colorado didn’t bother to stop Jamaal Charles on a simple run). OU? Bradford was in the fourth quarter throwing passes, and on OU’s last drive, they mounted an actual scoring drive culminating on going for it on fourth down at the opponent’s goalline. Lord knows what OU would have done with another possession.

Your arguments are stemming from ignorance from games and looking at stats without context. That’s why they’re doing nothing but making people laugh here. Texas was NICE against Colorado; we easily could have eclipsed 100 points. OU was actively trying to score 70 and failed by one yard. There’s a big difference.

And once again, you dismiss offensive stats without so much as acknowledging their validity and that you could have had just as hard a time with Tech at home! They were a great team in 2008.

Once again, you ignore points that these stats ARE NOT VALID. I never said they did not have a good team in 2008. What I said was that Tech has proven to struggle way more on the road than at home, and that pattern was also seen in 2008. How is 2008 offensive stats relevant here? You tell me. But once again, strawmen are always easier to punch at.

Furthermore, it is telling that while you continue to accuse me of ignoring things you say, you failed to address these refutations of your points:

1. Tech’s road performance in 2008 as discussed above in my posts and by ajax.
2. Leach’s overall lack of impressive road victories

Not only that, you once again are apparently trying to defend Stoops by making a big splash about margin of victory. The original comment was to poke fun at Stoops for thinking that his home victory over a team with documented road problems overshadowed a loss to his rival on a neutral site. You’ve done nothing but go on random tangents, throwing out stats without context or thought, and ignoring points and criticisms while repeating yourself. While this is amusing, it is starting to become painful.

Strike three.

by TheElusiveShadow on Jul 30, 2009 1:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

Colorado: The exception......

You say, we would never run up the score to please voters like you did. And you offer this for the Colorado game, the old “there is an exception to every rule” agument:

“For the game against Colorado when it was 70-3, the Horns had 70 points about midway through the 3rd quarter. Texas scored nothing after that. Not only that, our backup QB was put into the game at just after the ten minute mark of the third quarter. We threw two times with him during that span for a grand total of 22 yards. Now let’s look at what OU did against Tech:”
and
“After the Horns scored their last TD, they had four possessions and didn’t score (and Vince Young was already out for that last TD, and the second to last TD was just one play since Colorado didn’t bother to stop Jamaal Charles on a simple run).”

Every pundit who commented on that game clearly interpreted your margin of vicotry as sending a message to USC and the voters, you cannot deny the impact of your score, yet you claim it was unintentional. Your margin at the half was ridiculously high.

Margin of victory does play a part, no matter how much you claim to despise it. My bringing up the statistics of Tech and Texas’ total yards, average points per game, and average yards per game, was only intended to show that this year, Tech played well overall, as well as well away. I understand that Mississippi and Baylor were pitiful games for them.

Now an interesting question is, next season will Mack Brown put up 60 points on anyone, including OU? If he does so, buying into this margin of vicotry argument, I’m sure that you will not fault him in the least.

And finally, if a Sooner makes you angry, resort to personal attacks and baseball analogies to drive home your point.

OU -- 7 National Championships; 6 Big 12 Championships; 5 Heisman Winners; Most winning college football program since WW2
UT--4 National Championships; 2 Big 12 Championships; 2 Heisman Winners
Nuff Said!

by Boomer S on Jul 30, 2009 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

Colorado was freaking terrible that year

And they backed into the championship game. Let me paint you another picture of a 3-way tie in overall record. This one came in the North Division in 2005.

CU was 7-4, as were NU, and ISU. Get this though, CU lost to both ISU and NU that year. But guess who got to go to the championship game? CU, because they lost to Miami, and therefore had one more conference win. Even though the other two teams with the same record beat them. You can also thank ISU for losing to a 5-5 KU team by an overtime field goal that sent CU into the rematch with Texas. I seem to remember them showing Barnett’s face after that game ended, and his team was backed into the north spot, and he looked like he just ate a snickers covered in his own shit.

CU was also coming off its last two stellar games (the aforementioned ISU and NU match-ups) which saw them lose a combined 60-19, and had a streak of 6 straight quarters without scoring a touchdown heading into the UT buzzsaw.

Texas took out its starters after just 35 minutes of game clock. After that they threw two passes.

One was on a 3rd and 8 on their own 37, the other was on a 3rd and 12 on their own 40.

Besides that all we did was run the ball and play defense.

Colorado was freaking terrible that year, and yes they were just that bad.

If you want to argue that Texas shouldn’t have played a full 35 minutes of football with its starters, well I guess you are free to, but Colorado was just that bad. They finally scored another TD with 5:45 left to go against Clemson, making it a whole 13 quarters of touchdown-less football.

by BoddickerIsClutch on Jul 30, 2009 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

Wait a second

Let me get this straight. You offer Colorado as some sort of knock down example of the pot calling the kettle black (I repeat: You did). Then when I refute this notion by actually summarizing how we got to that score, you accuse me of just trying focus on some sort of “exception,” an exception that you yourself brought into the discussion? Are you reading what you’re writing?

It is clear you are trying to ignore points made against you by attacking strawmen, repeating arguments, and even accusing people of taking it personally when, well, nobody brought that up besides you, and everyone seems to think this is all funny besides you. No matter that it was shown to you that your logic that Good offensive stats → Good team overall → Good road team is atrocious. No matter that people have summarized Tech’s road season in 2008 and it was shown to be pretty unimpressive. Heck, you even resort to accusing people of bringing up games that you did.

By the way, strike three typically means your out. We gave you three swings, and you hit a good chunk of air on each one.

by TheElusiveShadow on Jul 30, 2009 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

And by the way

Why would we need to please voters? Are you crazy? We were #2 in the country, and we could have beaten Colorado 3-2 and still went to the Rose Bowl. I simply do not believe you watch any meaningful amount of football but just check box scores quickly at ESPN.

by TheElusiveShadow on Jul 30, 2009 3:38 PM CDT up reply actions  

It is pretty funny that it has gone on this far

When the original point was that when Stoops was asked about how last years controversey will play into this years RRR, he commented on the score of the Texas-TTU game score. He did not talk about the upcoming game. He talked about a game that we lost. In retrospect, the last 2 times that Stoops has stepped foot in Lubbock, he has walked away will a L. We shall see if his current bowl record and this Lubbock phenomenon are related.

by future_longhorn_dad on Jul 30, 2009 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

What does scoring offense, considered in a vacuum, have to do with whether a team is a good road team or not? That might be the most tangental retort I’ve seen in a while.

by burntorangehorn on Jul 29, 2009 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

Since 2002...

This is the internets, so these things can be looked up…
Since 2002 Tech is 20-20 on the road.
As far as I can tell they are 2-10 against ranked teams on the road. They beat what turned out to be a good Ole Miss team (10-3) in 2003, who were ranked #18 at the time, and beat #23 Kansas last year.
Most damning is the conference road record of 9-19.

by Rickyspub on Jul 29, 2009 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

OU is Effing Clownshoes

Reporter: “So Bob, have the events of last year – in terms of the tiebreaker system – changed the nature of the TX/OU game going forward?”

Poops: “Texas lost to Tech! Texas lost to Tech!”

Reporter: “Um..yes Bob, but I was asking about the TX/OU game in the context of the tiebreaker and…”

Poops: “Ya, well you’re fat…..and ugly!! Stoops out!!”

Reporter: “Did you just steal a line from Ryan Seacr….”

(Enter Billy Sims, holding a sixer of ‘The Beast’ by one if its five empty plastic rings while pounding the last one)

Billy: “Boooooomer! Boooooomer!
          C’mon Bob…give me a Soooooooner!”

"It's not that the Irish are cynical. It's rather that they have a wonderful lack of respect for everything and everybody."
-- Brendan Behan --

by Zeno of Citium on Jul 29, 2009 10:48 AM CDT reply actions  

I remember scheduling non D1 teams was mentioned by Mack while back (maybe it was last year’s media days). Has it been brought up at all this time? It would be great if they’d make it a rule that no big 12 teams could schedule non D1 teams (or bowl champions teams or whatever we call it now).

by UT_BKC on Jul 29, 2009 11:23 AM CDT reply actions  

College Fantasy Football and Texas Tech

1) College Fantasy Football is a lot of fun. I am in my second year of doing it. It’s free and comes with built-in stat tracker on CBS Sportsline. We are holding our draft this weekend. We limited it to just four conferences – Pac-10, SEC, Big 12, and ACC. We left out the Big 10 and the Big East. I think our commisioner overshot the runway though as it should be the Big 10 and not the ACC in our pool of teams to choose from. We still may have two spots left if anyone is interested with the draft being this weekend. Email me at robertpz@hotmail.com

2) ESPNU had the replay of the Tech/Texas game last night. I am sure somewhere Blake Gideon had his cell phone turned off. As I watched bits and pieces of it last night at the sports restaurant I manage, Will Muschamp’s half-time adjustments are just things of beauty. As we all know, we had our chances in intercepting passes the last two Tech drives, but fell short. Yet, knowing that you have a defensive mastermind like Will in your back pocket just gives Longhorn fans warm fuzzies. How any 4 or 5 star HS defensive guy who wants to play in the state of Texas doesn’t pick UT is beyond me?

by Robertpz on Jul 29, 2009 3:40 PM CDT reply actions  

Why leave out the Big East and Big Ten? I understand not wanting a conference that could turn into the old WAC, but those conferences aren’t going to do that, I don’t think.

by burntorangehorn on Jul 29, 2009 3:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

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