Burnt Orange Nation: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Sports blogs for fans, by fans.
New Blog: World Soccer Digest for Soccer Fans!

Player Haters (Basket)Ball...

...on the heels of the BON Roundball Roundtable, I wanted to provide a quick follow-up and allow each of you to play "Devils Advocate", which was nicely done in the comments.  After the jump, a quick scan of some of the recent UT Basketball-related articles and an invitation to "HATE HATE HATE HATE" on the sunshiny sentiments from the Roundtable.

Star-divide

Since it is my self-professed goal to help get everyone fired up for basketball--before our bowl game--I want to highlight a few of the better articles and features from this week.

1) Yahoo Sports Big XII Preseason Power Rankings: While only the Texas section is excerpted below, this article provides an solid first-take rundown on the conference.  Hard to quibble too much with the rankings, and it has a decent write-up over each team, rather than the one-sentence explanations that are just a waste of time.  Texas is ranked second behind Kansas:

Texas – Other than Kansas and Kentucky, there’s not a school in the country that boasts as much talent and depth as the Longhorns, who appear to have their best team of the Rick Barnes era. Damion James’ decision to withdraw from the NBA draft bolstered a frontcourt that should be one of the nation’s best with James, Dexter Pittman and Gary Johnson. The difference, though, will be Texas’ backcourt, which should be markedly improved thanks to the addition of Florida transfer Jai Lucas and standout freshman Avery Bradley. Lucas, a point guard, is expected to become the starter once he becomes eligible in December. A combo guard, Bradley is a consensus top-10 recruit who is a pest defensively. 

 

2) Recap of KD's Summer: This NBA.com feature outlined Kevin Durant's busy summer.  For all the "ONE AND DONE!!!!" folks who hated the decision to retire his number, please focus on the sections over his time in Austin.  For example:

After leaving the University of Texas for the NBA after just one season, Durant made a promise to himself and his family that he would continue to pursue his college degree. He kept up on that promise this summer, enrolling in a child adolescent class. The league’s fifth-leading scorer was back in class, interacting with classmates, raising his hand to be called on, doing homework and even turning in a 20-plus page book report.

Durant already said he was looking forward to doing it again next summer. But while he was in Austin, he found enough time to reconnect with the Longhorns basketball program. Organizing pick-up games just after sunrise wasn’t something that came about this offseason, but rather last summer along with the help of Thunder Assistant Coach Brian Keefe after Durant had finished his rookie season.

The pick-up games started at 6:30....AM.

3) Tristan Thompson = Good: These rankings--dug up by DimeCoverage--have Thompson as the 4th ranked prospect in 2010.  Daniel Bejarano is ranked 40th.

Onto the hating...

First off--for those of you who liked the roundtable, I think I speak for each of us when I say it would be our pleasure to do it again.  If you have any questions, please send them along, and I'll arrange another one as soon as we get enough good questions.  I've always loved PB's mailbag feature, and I think a mailbag/roundtable combo would be something that everyone would enjoy reading.  Just send to txtwstr7@gmail.com.

Second, with the current steady stream of articles constantly hitting up the front page of BON, it can be easy to get behind.  I got sick earlier this week, and it put me waaaaaaaaaay behind schedule during a pretty busy week.  While I had time to read most of the front-page stuff, I wasn't able to read all the comments, which are often as enlightening as the article itself.  With that in mind, I wanted to highlight an eye-opening comment from the post.

While Caradoc provided (yet another) good idea for a feature, the best comment came from "longtimelonghorn", who took it upon himself to play "Devils Advocate."  I think "longtimelonghorn" did a good job...see for yourself, through a slightly edited version below, where I focus on his key points and issue a few responses.

I’m as pumped about this team as everyone else, but the 8 page UT basketball summary didn’t seem to account for what could go wrong or why we might NOT be that good. So I’ll pretend to be an OU fan for a few minutes and bring up these points.

1. Ok, Pittman looks lighter in some videos. He made great strides last year and was shockingly able to play more than 10 minutes in a game. However, he’s still fat. He’ll still clog the lane: 4 out 1 in’s only gonna happen when Damion James is in the game and playing the 4. Your team doesn’t need a Dexter Pittman, it needs a James Thomas. Your team is relying on this guy to be your force in the middle. After that your center is?? He goes down, and you have Matt Hill guarding Tyler Hansborough. Face it, the W in CWH is ok, but the other two SUCK.

2. Every great team has one player that’s a leader who will carry the team on his back when he has to. The Horns made it to the Final Four with TJ Ford. Who’s gonna pull this team together when the other team goes on a run? Damion James? A freshman maybe?

3. So you’re relying on JBrown, a freshman point guard, academically ineligable for his first year, rumored headcase in highschool, great scorer but not passer… to be the starting point guard on a final four team. Assist to turnover ratios don’t lie. (for the record, I’ll predict Lucas as the starter).

4. Before you start buying tickets for Indianapolis remember this: you’re relying on freshmen for this team to make it there. Freshmen are question marks. The new guys will all want shots, even Avery Bradley. Furthermore, three of the new "fantastic four" coming in didn’t even play basketball last year. Where’s all the confidence coming from, BarkingCarnival practice videos?

5. So Barnes is phenomenal with managing players, and a loaded roster won’t be a problem? Some of the guys will just be happy to get a few minutes on a great team? Mike Williams and Dion Dowell might disagree with you.

Walking through these step-by-step:

1) If one of CWH can be productive (consensus seems to be Wangmene), then I'm not going to lose sleep over our third option at center potentially sucking against a National POY force.  Dex handled Blake Griffin pretty nicely in their unfortunately brief second encounter last season, and we "held" Griffin to a 20-10 game in Norman in a game where Dex only played 21 minutes to Griffin's 39 minutes.  Yes, there will be minutes to kill when Dex is on the bench, but it wont cripple this team.  If Dexter gets hurt...well, thats a different ballgame that we wont talk about.

2) PB brought this up in the roundtable and went with Avery Bradley.  I think he makes a good case.  As a military officer, there are leadership styles other than yelling in people's faces.  There is no better leadership style than "leading by example", which is where I think Bradley will excel, even as a freshmen.  If that doesnt convince you, then I'll quickly point out that Rick Barnes will also have a say-so in keeping this team from dogpiling on each other when things go south. 

3) I feel much better about J'Covan knowing that Balbay/Lucas/Mason/Ward can all immediately step in and take over if he doesn't play to his talent.  I dont want Barnes to jerk him around, but the floor-level expectations for the position are already in place...it's Brown who has a chance to adjust the ceiling.

4) The gaps in basketball for Hamilton/Lucas/Brown are a concern, but their play in tournaments and scrimmages (past and recent) leaves us with a pretty good idea of what they should bring to the table.  Honestly, I'd be more worried about the incoming freshmen, but this is where Dexter and Damion returning comes into play.  Instead of having to take everything onto their shoulders, the super talented freshmen are stepping into an offense that is returning two key starters (and potential superstars) who should average at least 15-10 a game.  For a point of comparison, KD started alongside three other freshmen and AJ Abrams; these freshmen will be starting alongside two legitimate studs who complement their individual games.  The key point here is that none of the freshmen will have to carry the brunt of the offensive load.  Instead, each of them wil fill important cogs in what should be a multi-dimensional and dangerous team.

5) I dont think Barnes and Dion Dowell got along--before the PT issues--and Mike Williams was a weird, weird, weird, weird dude.  I agree that PT is a concern, but I really think that the role emphasis of Barnes (along with potentially winning 30 games this season) will help keep everyone relatively content.

 Lest we be accused of failing to acknowledge or notice the faults of this basketball team, please feel free to continue spreading your "HATE HATE HATE HATE" on the Hyperizers in the comments...

Hook 'em!

1 recs  |  Comment 11 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

Criteria for success

This is probably the best talent that Barnes has ever had. Can he coach these guys successfully? What is the definition of success for this group? I suggest that if Barnes gets to the final 4, then he has met expectations. If he wins a game in the final 4, he has exceeded expectations. If he does not get to the final 4, then he has not met expectations.

Good questions raised by LongtimeLonghorn (easier to ask the questions than answer the questions, right?).

What happened with Awiggo? Usually he takes the lead on BON bball coverage.

“Since it is my self-professed goal to help get everyone fired up for basketball—before our bowl game”. Shouldn’t be much of a challenge, right? It will be really interesting to see how all these new stars fit together with the older players.

Re: Hyperizer, maybe the horns could do their own video (be sure to include Barnes). Bill Little could be the producer.

by Kafka on Sep 19, 2009 6:42 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

A Bill Little produced rap video

Would be so fresh.

by ctex80 on Sep 19, 2009 8:41 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

Wiggo is around...

…and he’s still the point man for UT Hoops. I’m just helping stir the pot during the offseason.

I haven’t set my “if we dont reach the _ ______, then Barnes is a failure” criteria…I’m more like “Hey, this could be THE season, if things go well.” Until I can see more—firsthand—from this team against decent competition, it’s hard to know where to set the minimum level of expectations.

I’ll touch on some ideas where UT could really, really help generate excitement for this team with my post next week…

by txtwstr7 on Sep 19, 2009 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

My takes

1) I agree that Wingman is the best of the three, but I’d like to see some of Chapman before I give up on him. The things he did right last year, he did well. Eventually he will be less lost on the court and maybe a free throw will go down. He got a lot of action in the open play videos, so it looks like Barnes is still trying to bring him along.

2) We had Durant and Augustine turn out to be pretty good leaders as freshmen, didn’t they? But ‘team leader’ and ‘go to guy’ aren’t necessarily the same.

3) Assist-to-turnover ratio can be misleading. Was Mason a great point guard last year? His ATR would say yes. Assists depend on a lot of factors, including the talent of your teammates. Turnovers include those a player makes while attempting to score as well as steals and those made passing to teammates.

4) So what about layoffs? These guys played in elite competition last year and all summer. How can they not be in shape?

5) PT may be limited, but the spotlight shines on players in a terrific schedule with tons of national exposure. UT players probably get more minutes in showcase games than anyone other than UNC.

So if I were to turn hater, what would I come up with?

6) Barnes does not seem to coach offense until late December. By then, our defense will be solid, but we will still not have an offensive system established and may rely too much on individual performances.

7) This team may lack the maturity to rebound from a big loss. Suppose Kansas creams us during the regular season. Can we pull it back together for other conference opponents? Does it take us out of our best game? Will Barnes have to resort to discipline?

8) Grades. Apparently, some football players think that homework is optional. And here we have a gang of high profile basketball players, many expected to stay only a year, who have to pass their fall classes to stay eligible.

Seriously, I don’t really believe any of that. Barnes will pull this team together and take it on to big things, but maybe this will advance the discussion. Cheers.

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. If they get mad, you're a mile away AND you have their shoes.

by Caradoc on Sep 19, 2009 9:55 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I think your last paragraph...

…encapsulates my thoughts over the potential weaknesses of this team.

While I can see things that COULD happen, I just don’t actually foresee any of them being a major problem. Even trying to take off my burnt-orange tinted glasses, I cant objectively point to this team/program and definitively state “ooooh, that’s gonna be a problem” over any of the aforementioned concerns. Not this year. Not this team.

by txtwstr7 on Sep 19, 2009 4:35 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

#6

I’m usually concerned about Texas teams running a good offense (not Barnes’ strong point in my opinion). These years team has plenty of guys who can create, though, and a 4 out 1 in, freeflowing type of offense where not many structured plays are called will work out fine for them. Barnes best offensive team was TJ Ford’s sophomore year, where Barnes pretty much just let him create for himself and everyone else in whichever way he saw fit.

This year the most important thing that Barnes needs to do is constantly remind the other players to get Dex the ball.

--always Texas--

by longtimelonghorn on Sep 19, 2009 4:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Roundtable continuation

I finally got around to readin the entire roundtable post (very long) and it was well worth my time. Glad that you are getting us excited about bball early, TXtwister. Thank you.

One thing I noticed is that Gary Johnson was hardly mentioned. His jump shot was getting better and is almost unblockable and I bet his defense and passing improve over the offseason. I’m not sure how he fits in, but he would give solid high energy minutes. I also would go with PB on Dogus, I think he could really be important to the team.

It’s good to get differing opinions and have devil’s advocates, but I expect this team to cut down the nets in March. Yes, we are relying on freshman a lot, but at the same time we have plenty of experience to create a balance (as you noted). Not to mention that players with the talent level of Bradley and Hamilton are no longer freshman come tourney time.

Three things that I really like about this team that we didn’t have last year is defense, team FT shooting. and multiple deep threats.

Thanks to GoBR, PB and Awiggo as well for taking time give bball some air time as we get into heavy football time. Texas is definitely a dual threat to take home MNC and March Madness.

by jimmer on Sep 19, 2009 4:28 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Glad that my hating was recognized

Good answers, Txtwstr. Truth be told, I’m not terribly concerned with any of those. I’m confident that this team will be very good, and potentially could go to the final four.

Two questions, though:
1. Do any of you Roundtable guys have a contact in the basketball program? It seems that people are excited about J’Covan Brown, and his play at the gym this summer must be the reason behind it.
2. Why is everyone so quick to throw Justin Mason under the bus? Did he have a poor summer? He ended the season poorly, but has the athleticism to still contribute. With him on the floor with Bradley we are a very athletic team, and excellent defending the perimeter. I’m fine with him getting solid minutes at the 2 and 3, as long as his minutes sharing the court with Balbay are limited for shooting reasons.

--always Texas--

by longtimelonghorn on Sep 19, 2009 4:34 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Quick answers...

1) Yes and no. I talk to a variety of people who talk to people, players, and coaches in the program. That would be hearsay in a court of law, but I think it’s ok for these posts. I can’t speak for who the other guys talk to, since I just dont know…

2) Mason has been snowed under by the influx of incoming and emerging guards. At best, he’s currently the 4th best option at PG and the 2nd best option at SG, even though I’d put him behind Ward, too.

While none of us want to throw him under the bus, I think the consensus is that we’d rather have the minutes go to the best players on the roster. Hopefully, we’ll blow out a ton of bad teams and share the minutes in those games. If Mason could shoot, things might be different, since he does a lot of things very well. It’s borderline depressing to go back and read the things PB and Wiggo have written about Justin Mason prior to last season…

by txtwstr7 on Sep 19, 2009 4:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

He will definitely get less minutes

but I still think he’ll get a decent amount of time. I personally think he’s one of the best all-around defenders UT has had in the Barnes era, and deservedly was on the Big 12 All-Defensive team last year.

I definitely echo the “if only he could shoot” sentiment though. I don’t understand how someone can regress in outside shooting as much as Mason did from his freshman to sophomore year.

--always Texas--

by longtimelonghorn on Sep 19, 2009 4:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

NBADRAFT.NET Class of 2013 Top Ten

NBADraft.net just released their top 10 Freshmen list with comments. Here’s what they had to say about Avery Bradley whom they listed at #6:
___________________________________________________________________

Avery Bradley 6-3 180 SG Texas Fr. — Has been built up as a combo and some rumors have him pushing to play PG for Texas at least part time as a freshman. In the half dozen times we’ve seen him he has appeared to be more of a 2 than a PG or combo.

He’s got a huge wingspan which counteracts the lack of height (6’3). He’s a tremendous defender and has both the quickness to get by opponents off the dribble as well as a picture perfect jumpshot. Regardless, he may need 2-3 years before he’s ready to take his game to the next level.

Anybody agree? Disagree? What are your thoughts????

by Misante Owens on Sep 21, 2009 11:23 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to Burnt Orange Nation, a blog dedicated to University of Texas athletics. Get BON updates via Twitter.
Start posting about the Longhorns »

Join SB Nation and dive into communities focused on all your favorite teams.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

T1_1018_coltheisman_small
Texas vs UC Irvine Gameflow (+/- stats included)
Horns_small
Thanks to our Men & Women in the Armed Forces
Small
The Aggies are doing just enough this year to give us a good upset.

Recent FanPosts

M_598158e49cdb59e28223bb8c9d9f2c20_small
Texas Longhorn Nike Pro Combat Jersey
Small
Ohio State and Oklahoma Uni's
Small
BCS Formula Question
2401104_1__small
The Perfect Storm of College Football
T1_1018_coltheisman_small
Texas vs Western Carolina Gameflow
Lemon_small
Pat Murphy resigns
Small
Orakpo says TCU can't hang
Clock_tower_small
The Weekly BON Hit Award Baylor
11-09_small
2009 Horns VS 2005 Horns....are we better? Equal? Worse?
Small
Vote for McCoy Saturday at Gate 25!

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

SPONSORS


Site Editors

Pb6_small Peter Bean

Dark_pumpkin_small awiggo

Menbooger_small GhostofBigRoy

Contributing Authors

Jersey_front_small 54b

Zombie_profilepic_small Horn Brain

Gse_multipart20834_small 40AS

Pigeons_small billyzane

Small whills

Brandedbevo1024x768_small dimecoverage

Rosebowl_small txtwstr7

Small TheElusiveShadow

Me_small burnt in ny

Official Partner of CBS Sports