Big 12 Expansion On Hold, West Virginia In Limbo
by Wescott Eberts (GoBR) on Oct 26, 2011 12:57 PM CDT
in Conference Realignment
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PrintDespite a Tuesday report that a Wednesday press conference announcing the move of West Virginia to the Big 12, the Mountaineers now appear to be in limbo after a Tuesday evening announcement that there would be no press conference and Wednesday reports that the Big 12 has put expansion on hold and cancelled plans to visit Morgantown.
Part of the delay may be in waiting for Missouri to finally make a move, but it also appears that there is some division among members of the Big 12 about whether to invite Louisville or West Virginia, with Texas Tech coach Tommy Tubberville taking to the airwaves in Dallas in support of Louisville because of the travel difficulties in getting to Morgantown and Kirk Bohls tweeting that the Sooners also prefer the Cardinals. Meanwhile, basketball coach Rick Pitino is campaigning for the Big East to add schools amidst reports that Louisville is lobbying hard behind the scenes for an invitation to the Big 12.
Moving beyond the absolute shock that the Big 12 is divided about something, make sure to keep in mind the first rule of conference realignment -- everything could change in a second. Stay tuned, as this is far from over.
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Split the difference and take 'em both
Great shots of the Tower. Great shots of kids. Available in DFW and throughout Texas.
by Hopkins Horn on Oct 26, 2011 1:00 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I know that WVU has done decently in the recent past as far as footall goes, but how do they stack up in all the categories that so many people have been writing articles about here and elsewhere?
TV market/eyes – I don’t know a lot about Morgantown, but wikipedia says its small..as in it makes Beaumont look huge. However, who in Louisville cares about the college team? Do you, Hopkins (or SRR if he comes over from BC) have any of the TV data? Do people from the SEC or Pac 12 tune in to watch WVU or Louisville? I would think so at least in the case of basketball.
Alumni – kind of goes with TV market, or the potential for there to be one. WVU does appear to have a fairly large student population, and thus many alumni.
Good road trip – I had to google morgantown to find where it was at
Academics – i have no idea about either of these schools. Its at the botom of the list because it seems to have taken a back seat in the reality of what is happening as compared to what people thought originally
To answer your question
WVU info
-Per year university size of 29.3K
-Endowment of $400 million
-Living alumni base of 170,000
-Academically, #164 in US News
- #150 and higher for West Virginia TV markets, unless you want to count Pittsburgh at #24, which you really shouldn’t
Anyone want to post L-Ville info?
Meat? They're made out of Meat? Meat.
by ihavethemelody on Oct 26, 2011 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Hey, this is Texas, we can count a few good dead ones
especially if they can still vote.
My thoughts exactly.
The give Missouri a shove in an eastward direction. First it was the Big Ten, now the SEC. They have seemed determined to leave, even when UT made concessions on revenue sharing and the LHN.
"Only angry people win football games." --DKR
Let's not forget
the honorable Senator from the state of Kentucky, who took a break from all his hard work creating jobs to demonstrate his nuanced interpretation of the conservative belief that government should allow free markets to operate without interference.
From the Times:
Two people with direct knowledge of the situation said that lobbying by the Senate minority leader, Mitch McConnell, Republican of Kentucky, including to David Boren, the president of the University of Oklahoma and a former senator, helped slow West Virginia’s admittance to the Big 12.
I guess Boren has an affinity for men without chins.
Simplicity is always the secret, to a profound truth, to doing things, to writing, to painting. Life is profound in its simplicity. - Charles Bukowski
men without chins
didn’t they have a hit in the ’80s.
Who are you?!
I'm Kick Ass!
by TexasGarcia37 on Oct 26, 2011 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Don't say you weren't warned
When you can’t get this song out of your head…
Simplicity is always the secret, to a profound truth, to doing things, to writing, to painting. Life is profound in its simplicity. - Charles Bukowski
by windycityhorn on Oct 26, 2011 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Lest this devolve into a political discussion...
…I don’t see anything wrong with the senator putting in a good word for his constituents so that they might get the best deal possible. They do this all the time in any number of situations. That’s hardly “interfering with free markets”.
Great shots of the Tower. Great shots of kids. Available in DFW and throughout Texas.
by Hopkins Horn on Oct 26, 2011 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah...
I don’t see anything wrong with a man campaigning on a platform of limited government interference involving himself in college football realignment. I’m sure the good people of WV agree that this senator’s opinion is just part and parcel of the free market.
I know we don't do politics here
So maybe I shouldn’t have posted, and if I offended anyone, I apologize.
But this is the Senate Minority Leader. He has it in his power to attempt to affect meaningful change to a system that we can all agree is badly broken. How can Congress do that? Well, for one thing they could threaten to take away the tax-exempt status of an organization that takes in hundreds of millions of dollars annually and yet refuses to pay its laborers, provide them with health benefits, or allow them to profit from the marketing of their images. And Congress threatened to do just exactly in 2006 — but of course it went nowhere.
Instead McConnell does nothing but stroke his nonexistent chin until a conference realignment deal is reached and agreed upon. But that deal is bad for a very politically-connected university in his state. So he uses his considerable power to delay the deal and possible scuttle it in Louisville’s favor.
So now we may have Louisville as a conference member instead of WVU. And that decision could be made not as a result of fan sentiment, or geography, or relative strengths of athletic programs, or academics… but because one state happens to have a better-connected senator than the other state.
And that is what pisses me off. So, I’m sorry I dragged political philosophies into this. Won’t happen again. But I can’t be the only person annoyed by this.
Simplicity is always the secret, to a profound truth, to doing things, to writing, to painting. Life is profound in its simplicity. - Charles Bukowski
by windycityhorn on Oct 26, 2011 2:31 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
not politics
McConnell simply called his buddy Boren, who he served in the Senate with, and asked for a favor, to take a good look at Louisville. This is what representatives and Senators are supposed to do, help their constituents. McConnell didn’t threaten the Big 12 with government interference. So you’re totally off base in your criticism.
by bu2 on Oct 26, 2011 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Luck
Note that WVU’s AD Luck probably used his connections as well. After his years with the Oilers, he got a UT law degree, ran the Houston Sports Authority which built Reliant Stadium, Minute Maid Park and Toyota Center and was GM of the Houston Dynamo and worked on the deal that eventually led to the start of contstruction of the Dynamo soccer stadium.
Now its politics
WV Senators are now getting politics involved. They are threatening a Senate investigation. Not surprisingly, they are both the opposite party from McConnell.
Here's the link
All of which, I meant to say, is a hell of a way to form a football conference. Welcome to another fun day in the Big 12.
Simplicity is always the secret, to a profound truth, to doing things, to writing, to painting. Life is profound in its simplicity. - Charles Bukowski
by windycityhorn on Oct 26, 2011 5:20 PM CDT up reply actions
WVU not helped
I suspected WVU would still get in whenever Missouri finally gets out. Now I suspect it will be Louisville. UConn probably got left out of the ACC this time because of their threats last time. Its one thing to do it behind the scenes like McConnel and Luck did. Its another to threaten people in a press conference.
I'm in favor of Louisville over WVU
I’d say take them both, but that’s only any good if we don’t split into divisions.
I like the 10 team config, I’m not sure what an 11 team schedule looks like, but I really don’t like the 12 team schedule.
Im in favor of WVU
Tommy T & Stoops wont have to make a trip out there but once every two years, travel is a non issue. What is a issue for some is WVU could turn out to be a pretty stout opponent in Football, something Louisville does not bring to the table.
WVU has the better football team, but I like Louisville for just about everything else
From wikipedia:
Since 2000 the Cardinals are the only NCAA team to win a BCS bowl game; to appear in the men’s basketball Final Four, the College Baseball World Series (4 times), and the women’s basketball Final Four and finish runner’s up in the College Cup.
Now, WVU has the stronger football team, but I think if Louisville got locked into some stronger recruits and better TV they would be about as competitive in the Big 12 as Missouri or A&M was.
Keep in mind also that Louisville’s basketball program makes more money than WVU’s football program. They’re basically the “Longhorns” of college basketball. From that aspect I think Louisville has much more upside to be a monster sports program, with an influx of Big 12 funding and Texas recruits.
They both suck in academics.
Which city has better hotels / bars / clubs / restaurants for visiting teams + fans?
l/ville - easy
oh hail the Purple and White
I don't think this is really a question.
Louisville has horse racing, river gambling, two historic downtown hotels, and plenty of awesome bars and restaurants. Fourth Street Live is more than enough.
From a football standpoint, WVU may be better now, but keep in mind that Charlie Strong has pulled in consecutive top 35 recruiting classes (last year’s was #21), won Big East coach of the year last season, and just signed a 7 year contract. We’ll be back to 2006 form soon, where we beat West Virginia and won the Orange Bowl. Right now, we have the youngest team in the FBS, are 3-4 (with all losses by 9 points or less), have a top 10 defense, and just beat a 5-1 Rutgers squad. West Virginia just got smeared by 26 points by Syracuse.
We will be good again.
by CARD_G6 on Oct 26, 2011 2:02 PM CDT via iPhone app up reply actions
Louisville just needs to recover from the smoking crater that Steve Kragthorpe left there
And they can be a very good football program once again. Bobby Petrino proved you can have an elite program there, and he didn’t have access to all the Texas talent that Strong will if they join the Big XII.
Also, their basketball stadium seats like 23,000 or something ridiculous like that, so their B-ball program makes a ton of money. Combine that with the fact that you get the L-ville TV market as well, and Louisville makes a lot of sense.
by 2.1 seconds left on Oct 26, 2011 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions
If it comes down to Louisville OR W.Va
I’d go with Louisville in a heartbeat. W.Va is a terrible road trip and will increase travel costs for minor sports.
Louisville brings five times more historical appeal in basketball than W.Va brings with football.
If Mizzou leaves, add L/ville, W. Va. and Cincy, and be done with it. Split Sooner and Longhorn into seperate divisions and allow for a cross over rival game as the SEC has done since 1992. We’d have a hell of a good football conference. And a beast in basketball.
oh hail the Purple and White
Icabod Tubberville
Since when did one win give this punk the hammer? I have a clue for the boys in the Big Whatever..How bout Boise St and forget all this east crap?
Because, from everything I've read thru all of this ...
… Boise St. seems more like a glorified community college than a stoutly attractive new conference member.
I definitely want WVu first, then Louisville (with a ND sidecar please)
WVu fans are rabid and travel and will add excitement. Louisville will be like UH (which I love, but don’t need in my conference).
The whole BCS needs to be shown the door, and get the damn playoff system in line so that teams can stay in conferences that have geographic sense.
The Boise to Big East to keep the autoqualifier is ridiculous. If McConnell’s involment can help toward that then I wouldn’t mind more involvement to fix the real problems.
We're Texas, We're not OK.
If Mizzou would stay we could have both
Then continue working a deal with BYU and ND as half-in players.
Mizzou needs to re-think their ill-fated move. The aggies need to go, but Mizzou needs to get over the BCS Bid for Kansas and stop acting like they will have a better run in the SEC. They won’t sniff an Orange Bowl bid over there.
We're Texas, We're not OK.
Mizzouri can leave.
Im so tired of Missouri, they need to go. They have whined since they tried to crawl in bed with the Big 10 and were refused. The powers that run Missouri have worn out their welcome, but they may be so whiney the SEC may no longer want them, that could be the hold up.
I keep going back and forth with them
They really are more trouble than they are worth. Let’s get rid of them, get L’ville and WVu and get 1 more team and be at 12.
Pinkel thinks way too much of himself and started popping off and that really soured me on Mizzou. And, they are truly one of the leaders of the instability. I just like their location and academics, but the truth is we will all be better off without them constantly being the debbie downer and naysayer.
They think Big XII treated them poorly when KU got the Orange bowl bid-they ain’t seen nothing yet like they will be treated worse than Iowa State in the SEC. Like everything else in life, I’d rather have a team that wants to be with us than one that doesn’t.
We're Texas, We're not OK.
Mizzou’s miss on the Orange Bowl was their own doing. KU fans travel better. And yes Mizzou beat KU head to head, but they also had 2 losses to KU’s 1. Sucks I know, but it also has to be noted that the KU bid was an at large bid, not the AQ bid. Therefore the bowl had discretion on who to invite. Here’s a tip for Mizzou: if you want to get the invite, start traveling better. The Big 12 had no say in whether it was KU or Mizzou. They can cry all they want, but it’s not up to the Big 12. Remember 2006 was the same year we were relegated to the Alamo bowl below AM who went to the Holiday Bowl even though they had a worse conference record. But we didn’t cry like Mizzou.
by Bevo Red on Oct 26, 2011 8:46 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Amazing Grace and Graham Crackers.
So how do we discuss this particular issue without discussing politics? Do we simply substitute the word “idiot” or “moron” for any and every politician and have the conversation proceed as always?
If a man is alone in the woods and he speaks, if no one hears him,,is he still wrong?
Why not add Louisville and West Virginia? That will get the league up to 12 if Missouri stays or 11 if they go. The Big 10 had 11 teams for years. Plus if Missouri goes, the Big 12 would only need one more School to get back to 12.
by Ryan2907 on Oct 26, 2011 8:51 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
plus having Louisville and West Virginia would give both schools a relatively close conference ally.
by Ryan2907 on Oct 26, 2011 8:55 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
I hope the Big 12 adds West Virginia
and good riddance to missouri, if the sec wants them they can have ’em.
OU vs. UT
OU wants a 12 team conference and Texas wants to stay at 10 teams. OU is trying to force the issue. The only graceful way out of this situation is to accept both teams. You could potentially play round robin with 11 teams, which means canceling one non-conference game. Everybody has at least one cup cake they can buy off cheap. Or you can add someone like Cincinnati and return to the playoff format. Texas-Oklahoma power struggles are always “interesting”.
Pass on both
Rutgers is the only school with any academic chops. The remaining Big East football schools are cesspools academically.
Take Rutgers and to some two-some combination of BYU, Air Force, and/or Notre DAme (yes, I used the ND phrase) for all sports but football.
Done.
Rutgers
is a likely Big 10 expansion or ACC expansion candidate. They will wait for that instead of trying to travel to Big 12 schools from NJ. Their athletic department doesn’t make enough money to cover the travel costs for that.
Meat? They're made out of Meat? Meat.
by ihavethemelody on Oct 27, 2011 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions
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