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Why do we have conference tournaments?

KANSAS CITY, MO - MARCH 12:  "Momma, my legs won't work!" Jordan Hamilton #3 of the Texas Longhorns lays on the court after a play against the Kansas Jayhawks during the 2011 Phillips 66 Big 12 Men's Basketball Tournament championship game at Sprint Center on March 12, 2011 in Kansas City, Missouri.  (Photo by Jamie Squire/Getty Images)

I have yet to see any good sense in conference tournaments as they now operate. I think it is profoundly stupid.

Now, you may ask, "What in the hell did you do last night, whills?" I saw something ridiculous...worse than proving a negative.

Now those who are tolerably sane and stable, with good sense rooted deeply in how things are are the moment, may well ignore this. The rest of you are fish in my barrell.

My rigorous and unrelenting analysis - well primed I might add, with special secret ingredients - shows that conference tourneys usually either reiterate what we already know or they merely inject some inane, irrational consequence into the Big Dance. But whichever outcome occurs, a couple of prime teams almost always enter the NCAA playoffs with tired bodies and legs if they don't have the good sense to lose early (h/t 54b).

This is what is stupid and utterly without merit for either the teams involved, the Big 12-2 or the NCAA tournament. We all appreciate redemption but do you think the Big 12-2 conference tournament and conference tournaments in general are the proper stage for this? The hell, you say. Gird your loins and jump over to the dark side...bring your own special ingredients, if need be.

Star-divide

Here is the Big 12-2 attempting to send the best teams that it can offer to slay the forces at the gate that have the temerity to think they're better than us. Do we need to give the sonofabitches any help? Well, we do, and I think it undercuts the whole process leading up to the NCAA tournament.

Well, surely, it's Selection Sunday afternoon, and you're suddenly suggesting the Big 12-2 Conference Tournament should be kicked to the bar ditch like so many empties from an all night binge? Not exactly, Kemo Sabe.  Just part of it.

It seems to me that the wiser and smarter course would be to give the top two teams and maybe the top three or four, depending on the year, the competition and the relative humidity, a bye through the whole tournament. Ole those bad boys all the way through.  Let the pissants that need a berth fight it out mano-a-mano, jaw-to-mandible, shaky leg-to-shaky leg to find some redemption in a season gone awry.

Let the best teams in the tournament rest their legs and bodies the whole time. Then they might be able to accomplish much more in the NCAA tournament, represent the Big 12-2 and themselves in a much better fashion.

Well, you say, with the best of rational intentions, that the Selection Committee and the related die-hard fans want to know to the nth degree and pick the glass out of their feet before the selections are made. Didn't anyone ever tell you that when you pursue anything over the 95+ percentile that everything gets more and more expensive in a tangential fashion and still will never hit 100% - perfection is unattainable. And even if it was, it wouldn't make that much difference. Strange, this life, you know.

You take the physical edge off your best teams trying to discover something the whole season has already provided pristine, definitive answers to - and then the tournament does some minor rearrangement of the pack. Anyone in the pack ain't gonna win the NCAA 95% of the time. It ain't gonna happen. But most of them with a decent season will get their shot, so their whiney asses are covered.

This year Kansas and Texas should have had a bye all the way through and should have never played a game in KC.

Now Gary Johnson's legs have been worn out like those of Hamilton and the freshmen earlier - he was older and more seasoned but even he was losing his spring by the end of the regular season. The question is will he get them back in a week? What if he didn't have to endure three more games? Think about that when the Horns get to the Sweet 16. The best example will be UConn - five games and then two more, if they're lucky, in under two weeks - forget it...they won but it will probably cost them big time.

Being the wise and astute BONers with a season full of experience and the wonder of clarity and good judgment, you can say I'm full of it - undoubtedly true, we know - but doesn't my proposal make better sense than our present situation? You will still tune in at 5 today to see who goes where, tired legs and all. 

Hook 'Em

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Not so sure I agree about a tournament with only the lower seeds

but I do agree that it can destroy the legs of players. Depending upon their match ups, I don’t see UConn making the Elite 8 and may not survive this weekend. They were playing solely on adrenaline in the semis. Once that wore off today, I don’t see them getting going again.

by RQ on Mar 13, 2011 3:43 PM CDT reply actions  

The NCAA post season tournament has been evolving for the last 20 years.

It just seems more sensible to play to the big tourney rather than waste your best teams in a conference tournament whose present utility is minimum.

Give the regular season winner a berth. Exempt other good teams (two or three) sure to be in the top 20 or so a pass through the conference tournament; they will be seeded and make the NCAAs without a problem. Let the others fight for the guaranteed tournament berth.

I think if we stopped the Big 12-2 tourney cold, we’d have an advantage over conferences which do have one.

by whills on Mar 13, 2011 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't buy into this fatigue theory, esp not for this Texas team

Between the ages of 18 and 22 your legs are still fresh and don’t tire from playing games (unless you’re out of shape, which none of the players in this year’s team are). If anything, most practices and weight sessions are longer and more exhausting than a game. At most, a guy is playing 38 minutes with a halftime and several timeouts and other stoppages in between. It ain’t the games.

by feltgod on Mar 13, 2011 3:52 PM CDT reply actions  

Wood floors are the killers. I've seen this at every level.

By the end of the season, legs lose their spring. You can definitely tell it in kids who come out for track or baseball…usually it takes two weeks or so for their legs to regain normalcy after being keyed to sprinting short distances (not over 30 yards). Different muscles and muscle grouping.

by whills on Mar 13, 2011 3:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

But you've also got to take into account ...

… traveling to the tournament sites, on buses, on planes, being out in front of the media constantly, and generally being out of your home place for a very long weekend. It’s not just the games. All of that other crap has GOT to grind on all those players AND the coaches something awful. March Madness is already stressful enough without having to endure a stupid redundant post-season tourney to figure out who the conference’s best teams are … when you’ve already plainly figured that out over the course of 2 months.

by robthecob on Mar 13, 2011 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Somewhat agree...

I believe 2 games in 2 days is good but over that you start to push it. That said I think Barnes used a longer rotation which helped to an extent.

One piece I think you miss out on and thats easy to overlook is that having 2 full weeks of is only can also be a negative in being out of rhythm or rusty. Especially with the way this Texas team was playing prior to the tournament, I think this tournament was quite helpful in restoring some of our movement and offensive rhythm.

Did we miss some shots yesterday due to tired legs? Almost assuredly, but we were getting much better shots and ball movement which I would rather have than just fresh legs heading into the tournament.

J’Covan, Wingman, Lucas and Hill were also able to reassert themselves and get more PT which should also help in stretches during the tourney.

by HornsUpInLA on Mar 13, 2011 3:54 PM CDT reply actions  

Agree with Barnes tactics for playing more people yesterday.

And being able to refine their game is a lucid point.

If they only played two games, I really wouldn’t have an argument. Three or more, though…

by whills on Mar 13, 2011 4:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

Problem solved ...

… by shrinking the conference tourney. See my post below. Having all 12 Big 12 teams in it is ridiculous. The Big East letting all 16 teams into the tourney is even 33% more ridiculous. “Stupid is as stupid does.”

by robthecob on Mar 13, 2011 4:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Definitely agree with you there...

But the fan in me and the part that cares about the seeding would have had a hard time with losing to aggy to make it a 2 game tourney

by HornsUpInLA on Mar 13, 2011 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

I do tend to agree with your basic premise of hurting yourself come national tourney time.

However, post-season tourneys are pretty commonplace. It’d be pretty weird to not have one. There’s also no way that a greedy conference nowadays would forfeit so much $$$. My big beef, though, is why the heck do they let all 12 teams (100%) into the conference tourney?! Good grief! Does the regular season not mean a thing? The big tourney only lets in 68 of 346 possible teams (about 20%) … and it seems too big already. If you’ve got to have one, please give some credit to the regular season and only let the top 8 or 6 teams play. A nice 3-day, 6-team tourney (50% make it in) would be fine. #1 & 2 seeds would get 1st-round byes and, thus, would have a max of 2 games that weekend. That’d definitely preserve their legs for the all-important run to the Final Four & subsequent conference recognition.

by robthecob on Mar 13, 2011 3:58 PM CDT reply actions  

That's a really strong compromise.

We realize 6-12 have only some hopes to stay alive. Doing a tourney with the top six (and next year that would be 1-6, with 7-10 staying in this example) would be more like a qualifiers meet like they do in HS track for the dead week before regionals (or even in college, with Last Chance meets to qualify for the NCAA finals).

by whills on Mar 13, 2011 4:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Even better. I like that.

Really, we’d have to be privy to those closed-door meetings between conference ADs when the tourney is discussed to understand the need to include every member. I’m really wondering what the purpose is of including every team. If it brings in money to everyone, then I don’t think we’ll ever get away from 100% inclusion. As a compromise, maybe just take the top 6 or 8 and then still funnel some of the tourney income to the teams that don’t qualify. Maybe that’d make everyone happy – if the ISU AD (for example) knew that he could count on tourney income each year. I guess I’m more of a purist of competition. I think that only the best teams should merit being in the tourney. Reward those teams who rise above the others during the season.

by robthecob on Mar 13, 2011 4:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

If a couple of teams went farther in the Big Dance

that may help send more dollars to those teams who don’t get into the conference tourney, thus perhaps equalizing some of the ‘loss’ for the conference tourney.

by whills on Mar 13, 2011 4:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

I disagree with it ... How can SDSU and North Carolina both be ahead of us?

Same record as UNC with a head to head win and stronger SOS, stronger Conference.

SDSU…. I feel like I shouldnt have to make that argument

by HornsUpInLA on Mar 13, 2011 4:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think that's the argument.

…he didn’t feel he had to make. I agree with you. They finally beat BYU, and no one else comparable to our schedule

by vy til i die on Mar 13, 2011 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't agree with him

But I guess I could be biased. Don’t see how UNC is any better than we are though, just because they ran through their pathetically bad conference while we struggled at the end of our better one. Especially since we beat them head to head. Same number of losses and we have much better wins.

by GoHornsGo90 on Mar 13, 2011 4:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Damn

Posted 5 seconds too late lol. Totally agree with HUILA about SDSU that you shouldn’t even have to say anything.

by GoHornsGo90 on Mar 13, 2011 4:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

#2, #3, #12, or #16. It doesn't matter.

If you end the regular season 2-3 and then lose the tourney title game, you don’t get to call the shots. You just take what they give you. If you’re good & gritty enough, you put that #3 chip on your shoulder and run roughshod over whoever they put you up against, wherever they put you up against ‘em. We’re Texas … and we don’t whine. I don’t think any of these players really care what slot they get. They’re just ready to make a run at the title.

by robthecob on Mar 13, 2011 4:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Look at Missouri State

MO St. won the MVC regular season championship, and lost a close game to Indiana State in the championship game, but yet they are about to be left out. just a few days in some random city where you can string together a few wins is not a better measure of a true champion than a double round robin

by Frazier90 on Mar 13, 2011 4:55 PM CDT reply actions  

Conference tournament is pointless ...

… except as money-maker for the league. I’ve been saying this for years to anyone that will listen. If you earned the conference championship over the course of a 16 game season, then you’re the champion. How can you lose it in a silly money-making exhibition tournament? If an underdog wins, it lessens the hard-fought regular season championship.

I feel the same about the Championship game in football, though I realize that in those one-loss seasons it provides another big game and SOS for MNC game consideration.

by rezboscace on Mar 13, 2011 8:09 PM CDT reply actions  

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