Help Pick the All-Time Big 12 Team
by ElongatedHorn on Apr 16, 2011 10:32 AM CDT
in Texas Longhorns Football
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It's never too early to start planning the 2011 issue of the Eyes of Texas magazine. Due to that universal truth, we're putting together a feature on the all-time Big 12 team, and we need your help. Below is a line-up of a proposed team. For defense, we have four linemen, three linebackers, two corners and two safeties. For offense: one QB, two running backs, two receivers, one tight end and five linemen. Also, a kicker, punter, kick returner and one head coach.
OK, so, leave your comments below. Who would you take out? Who would you put in? Oh, and try to be unbiased (just a little). Let's go!
| Tommie Harris | DL | Oklahoma |
| Ndamukong Suh | DL | Nebraska |
| Brian Orakpo | DL | Texas |
| Grant Wistrom | DL | Nebraska |
| Teddy Lehman | LB | Oklahoma |
| Dat Nguyen | LB | Texas A&M |
| Derrick Johnson | LB | Texas |
| Quentin Jammer | CB | Texas |
| Terence Newman | CB | Kansas State |
| Roy Williams | S | Oklahoma |
| Michael Huff | S | Texas |
| Vince Young | QB | Texas |
| Ricky Williams | RB | Texas |
| Adrian Peterson | RB | Oklahoma |
| Roy Williams | WR | Texas |
| Michael Crabtree | WR | Texas Tech |
| Daniel Graham | TE | Colorado |
| Dominic Raiola | OL | Nebraska |
| Andre Gurode | OL | Colorado |
| Jammal Brown | OL | Oklahoma |
| Justin Blalock | OL | Texas |
| Aaron Taylor | OL | Nebraska |
| Mason Crosby | K | Colorado |
| Daniel Sepulveda | P | Baylor |
| Darren Sproles | KR | Kansas State |
| Bob Stoops | CO | Oklahoma |
Well, whataya think? Let the arguing begin...
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Hence the All-Time "Big 12" Team
"Try not. Do, or do not. There is no try."
- Yoda
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by ElongatedHorn on Apr 16, 2011 8:16 PM CDT up reply actions
How do you leave out...
Shipley at WR or Thomas at TE?
"you can't be a great defense in a casual manner!" Manny Diaz
Some changes
Generally solid picks.
Russel Okung instead of Gurode, but it’s close,
Rashaun Woods is a fairly obvious choice over Roy Williams.
Quentin Jammer on that list is a joke right? Picking him over Derrick Strait is terrible. Fellow longhorn Aaron Ross was much better as well.
Other than that, pretty solid all time list.
Meat? They're made out of Meat? Meat.
by ihavethemelody on Apr 16, 2011 12:22 PM CDT reply actions
Rashaun Woods is a fairly obvious choice over Roy Williams
Really? I think someone is letting NFL career alter their memories. When he was at UT, Williams was unstoppable and is one of the easists names to put on this list. Woods, Shipley, Welker were all solid, but Crabtree and Williams are head and shoulders the best two WR to play in the Big XII era.
by amarillotxhornfan on Apr 16, 2011 6:14 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think you remember how good woods was
and speaking of NFL careers, woods isn’t even playing in it anymore, and Williams still is.
Woods was a 2 time All American (beating out williams). He is the only player in big 12 history with more TD’s, Receptions, and Yards than Williams. They played at the same time. He had less talent around him. He stepped up big time when it counted (especially vs OU). He had THREE seasons with more than 1,000 yards, one of only 8 players to do so.
So yeah, it’s pretty obvious. They played at the same time in college, and Rashaun had better stats, always came up big when it mattered, and was recognized as being better in just about every post season award category you could think of.
Williams is 3rd on the list of Big 12 wide recievers.
Meat? They're made out of Meat? Meat.
by ihavethemelody on Apr 16, 2011 7:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh
and he has the most touchdown catches out of anyone from a BCS conference. He’s 5th on the all time receptions list. And he’s 3rd all time in recieving yards, with the most out of anyone from a BCS conference.
Meat? They're made out of Meat? Meat.
by ihavethemelody on Apr 16, 2011 7:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Woods had more stats, but Roy made a bigger impact.
Ask yourself question: Who was a better player in college?
"Try not. Do, or do not. There is no try."
- Yoda
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by ElongatedHorn on Apr 16, 2011 8:18 PM CDT up reply actions
QB- Vince Young, Texas
RB- Adrian Peterson, Oklahoma
RB- Ricky Williams, Texas
WR- Michael Crabtree, Texas Tech
WR- Jordan Shipley, Texas
TE- Jermaine Gresham, Oklahoma
OL- Russel Okung, Oklahoma State
OL- Leonard Davis, Texas
OL- Trent Williams, Oklahoma
OL- Justin Blalock, Texas
OL- Jammal Brown, Oklahoma
DL- Ndamukong Suh, Nebraska
DL- Gerald McCoy, Oklahoma
DL- Brian Orakpo, Texas
DL- Grant Wistrom, Nebraska
LB- Derrick Johnson
LB- Von Miller, Texas A&M
LB- Dat Nguyen, Texas A&M
CB- Derrick Strait, Oklahoma
CB- Terence Newman, Kansas State
S- Roy Williams, Oklahoma
S- Michael Huff, Texas
Visit my blog on all things college football, Pigskin Phenom.
I'd go along with that
Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. If they get mad, you're a mile away AND you have their shoes.
Wes Welker
How can you leave out wes welker at wr?
If God wanted us to be vegetarians, he would've made broccoli more fun to shoot at.
Had one great year.
"Try not. Do, or do not. There is no try."
- Yoda
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by ElongatedHorn on Apr 16, 2011 8:19 PM CDT up reply actions
You need the all time winning-est quarterback and his star receiver on this list.
McCoy>Young
Shipley>Crabtree>Williams
"you owe it to yourself to be the best in baseball and in life" Pete rose.
F the jets, bills, patriots and cryboys...and sooners, but go phins, longhorns, dodgers and stanford!
Driver of the ryan williams go-kart.
?
Shiply > 2 time Biletnikoff winner?
by KratosWasASooner on Apr 16, 2011 6:07 PM CDT up reply actions
And he leaves off
Rashaun Woods, who everyone seems to forget about, who should be 2nd behind crabtree.
Young was better than McCoy. He had a better arm, better ability to spread out a defense, and could stay healthy. He single handidly beat the second best team in college football (with an assist from an idiotic lendale white up the middle that everyone saw coming).
Meat? They're made out of Meat? Meat.
by ihavethemelody on Apr 16, 2011 7:11 PM CDT up reply actions
That was not idiotic
It was the right call; it just didn’t work out. Trojan Football Analysis had a great article on it; unfortunately, it seems to no longer be up. In essence, you go for it behind your great offensive line, with a player that was running very reliably, and on a play that had worked all game. It was a matter of execution. It’s easy to call stupid in hindsight, but it was the correct move at the time. Believe me, I sure wanted them to punt.
by TheElusiveShadow on Apr 17, 2011 5:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Can't pick Colt over Vince
Vince was arguably the best college QB ever for 1 1/2 years. Just can’t do it.
"Try not. Do, or do not. There is no try."
- Yoda
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by ElongatedHorn on Apr 16, 2011 8:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Ummmmm, no
Crouch might be the most overrated Nebraska QB ever. An option QB who is loathe to pitch the bal is not one of the best in Big 12 history.
by Beergut on Apr 16, 2011 11:44 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Sure he is overrated.
But that doesn’t mean he doesn’t deserve some consideration. Derek Jeter is overrated, too. But he still has had a great career.
Your stated issue with Crouch “option QB who is loathe to pitch” is an aesthetic issue. Setting this aside, I think Crouch is on the list of guys you would consider as the best Big 12 QB not named Vince Young. Why is that? Here is a list of all the guys you might contemplate. And I am trying to be very inclusive with this list, as obviously most of these guys don’t belong. So think of this list as my way of brainstorming possible quarterbacks.
Texas: C. McCoy
OU: Bradford, White, and Heupel.
NU: Crouch
Mizzou: Chase Daniels, Gabbert, and Brad Smith
A&M: Reggie McNeal
TTech: Harrell, Kingsburry
OSU: Robinson
KU: Reesing
KSU: Freeman, Ell Robertson, and Bishop
Of this list, I think you can pick a few guys who are in the running for #2 QB in Big 12 history. Your list and my list will probably differ, but my list includes:
McCoy
Bradford
White (who I don’t care for, but I am putting him here just because of the Heisman)
Crouch
I think these guys stand above all of the others.
The case for Crouch basically boils down to:
1) From 1999-2001 the Nebraska offense was very good.
2) Crouch was the key figure in the Nebraska offense in those three seasons.
I don’t know that this puts him ahead of Bradford and McCoy, but he certainly is worth considering.
Corby Jones and Michael Bishop were better QBs than Crouch ever thought about being
Hell if you just look at Nebraska QBs, I’d put Scott Frost ahead of Crouch. He won a national championship (it was a bogus one that was split with Michigan, but still….), and he ran the option correctly.
Being an option QB who doesn’t want to run the option is not an aesthetic issue, it is a hindrance issue.
All Big 12 Team
QB Vince Young Texas
RB A Peterson OU
RB Ricky Williams Texas
WR M Crabtree Tech
WR Ryan Broyles OU
TE Chase Coffman Mizzu
T Jamal Brown OU
T Leonard Davis Texas
G Andre Gurode Colo
G Aaron Taylor Neb
C Vince Carter OU
DE Corey Redding Texas
DE Brian Orakpo Texas
DT Casey Hampton Texas
DT N Sue Neb
OLB Von Miller ATM
OLB D Johnson Texas
MLB D Nguyen ATM
CB D Strait OU
CB T Newman KSU
FS M. Huff Texas (he played everywhere)
SS Roy Williams OU
K Alex Henry Neb
P Shane Lechler ATM
KR/PR Antonio Perkins OU
Coach Bob Stoops (Yuck but numbers say he is)
Including Leonard Davis is a joke right?
I also think Mike Brown from Nebraska deserves consideration at safety.
Roy Williams at WR is laughable. He disappeared every year against OU. I’d put Sam Bradford at QB.
by Beergut on Apr 16, 2011 11:40 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
you call what gobr did trolling..
…and this is?
by vy til i die on Apr 18, 2011 9:39 AM CDT up reply actions
Roy Williams isn't even all-decade in the Big 12
Crabtree and Blackmon at OSU are both better than him
defend Williams
he disappeared when his team needed him most
name one OU game where he did ANYTHING special
Solid ... but has always been a bit overrated.
Very solid LB in small space but I’ve never understood why he got any national awards or even AA. Probably due to a dearth of talent at the position at the time. Seemed like he always got too much greatness attributed to him just for that UT pick falling in his lap. Dat, DJ, & Vonn, were easily on a higher level. ‘Spoon from Mizzou, CU’s Russell, KSU’s Simoneau, Calmus, for sure, & a couple other sooners were all better & more dynamic than Lehman.
DL
Bounce Harris for Casey Hampton, who dominated in college while Harris was more of a distraction to open things up for lehman, Cody, Dvoracek, etc.
Also, Earl over Huff. He could do everything Huff did only better.
The defensive list would have to start with Casey Hampton. He and Suh are the two best defensive players the Big XII ever produced.
"It's not that the Irish are cynical. It's rather that they have a wonderful lack of respect for everything and everybody."
-- Brendan Behan --
by Zeno of Citium on Apr 17, 2011 10:07 AM CDT up reply actions
as a lifelong Texas fan this burns a little
but i would add a second QB Sam Bradford (led a record setting prolific O) and at TE Jermaine Gresham (he was unstoppable and i hated him).
Also, was Earl Thomas not good enough long enough to make the list? He was pretty much a turnover machine his JR year but i cant remember the first two accurately enough to know the whole picture.
Earl left just when he was getting his due recognition for being great.
One more year would have sealed his inclusion at the top of the Big 12 DB lists. Gresham has always been underappreciated (while Bradford is always overappreciated) in that pinball run-up-the-score offense for one year but I agree that he was great. His Sr. year injury probably knocks him down a peg. For me, Colt easily earned the nod as the 2nd team QB on this list ahead of Bradford & several other greats (Michael Bishop) & Heisman winners and a recent AP poll sad as much. He was prolific for a 4-year career of all-purpose athleticism, precision (all-time best NCAA completion %), & leadership. Funny that the 2 best QBs in Big 12 history did not win the Heisman but many of the other candidates did. It’s also amazing to me that DJ Johnson is not the all-time defensive POY in the conference. He was, quite simply, the best college defensive player I’ve ever seen.
3-4?
A better front 7 of Big 12 players would go:
NT: Hampton
Ends: Tommie Harris and Ndamukong Suh
OLB: Von Miller, Sergio Kindle
ILB: Derrick Johnson, Teddy Lehman
The front 3 would be impossible to contain, Miller and Kindle would go untouched in the backfield all day.
i'd replace kindle with O-sack-po
Kindle is talented but i feel his best games came opposite of Rak.
by dukeoforange on Apr 18, 2011 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions
you were doing fine until you got to Kindle at OLB
he isn’t big enough to play OLB, especially on the strongside, and would get run over
I’d also replace Johnson with Dat Nguyen
You were doing fine 'til you replaced Johnson w/ Dat.
Kindle should not be on the 1st-team here but Johnson is the best defensive player the league has ever seen.
Nguyen
I was going to bet money if Vegas had odds that you were gonna suggest Nguyen over Johnson. I wanted someone with more range and even though he is out of position here it feels silly to leave DJ off the list.
As for Kindle, I’ll forgive your ignorance. Kindle played strongside 9-tech at least half the snaps of 2009 and avoided being run over. He weighed like 255, he isn’t another Von Miller.
Not that it really matters since he’d be playing next to Ndamukong Suh and going untouched by OL half the time. I’d allow you to put Jaxson Appel there and the strongside would still be fine.
O-sack-po
I would agree that Rak is the better pass-rusher but my thinking was this:
We’ve already got 3 tackles on the field who can collapse the pocket and we’ve got Von Miller screaming around the edge so what I want from my other OLB is a guy who can make plays in pursuit and against the run. I like Kindle for that better than Orakpo. If you want to replace Von Miller with Orakpo that’s fair. So really, I don’t think Kindle was the better player than Orakpo but just more suited to this specific purpose.
In general I think the 3-4 gets more talent on the field on an All-Big 12 list just because there are so many phenomenal tackles that it would pay to get on the field.
Hampton at DT
Oh, and dream backfield. Any chances they recreate this in Minnesota by signing Ricky and VY? Please excuse me while I wipe up my drool.
I'd put Shane Lechler in at punter
and OU’s Antonio Perkins and Tech’s Wes Welker deserve consideration for PR
Perkins was solid but Welker & Shipley are 1A & 1B in my eyes.
The Big 12 has had so many great return men. So hard to pick just one. I’ll take Ship’ in the big games though.
agree with beergut
Welker and Shipley were pretty good but Perkins had like 5 PR touchdowns in one season. I don’t remember Shipley approaching that in his entire career, he just had 2 returns of notable consequence and one was as a kick returner.
Perkins was terrifying.
Zach Thomas
Got to spend his Senior Year where he was consensus All American in the Big 12. It deserves at least a mention with Dat at MLB.
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